Joe Biden's a little like The Mouth That Roared -- he's very smart and articulate, yet you never know quite what's going to come out of his mouth next. He's among the second tier of Democrat presidential aspirants, and is probably really running for a vice-presidential slot on the ticket, along with Chris Dodd and Bill Richardson.But he might not even be in the vice-presidential sweeps for long with statements like this, from an interview and article published today about Barack Obama in the New York Observer:
"I mean, you got the first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy," he said. "I mean, that's a storybook, man."Is anyone else a little uncomfortable with how that sounds? One of the reasons I am intrigued by Obama is that he represents a move forward from the old-line civil rights black leadership (Jessie Jackson, Al Sharpton), whose views, tactics, and style are way past the due date for a large segment of the black community.
That community is shifting (or wants to be able to shift) to the middle and upper classes. I'd put him in there with Harold Ford, Bill Cosby, and Juan Williams on the left, and on the conservative side Thomas Sowell and Walter Williams. They're people who refuse to buy into the old stereotypes and the "blame whitey for everything" that the other black leaders still cling to.
But for Biden to say that Obama is the "first mainstream African-American who is articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy"? What's he implying? And compared to whom?
The equivalent for him would be to say of Hillary Clinton: "she has some good views, for a blond woman".
There are ways to say what I think he wanted to say about Barack Obama (i.e. with only two years in the Senate, Barack's too inexperienced) without giving him a backhanded borderline bigoted insult.
Who know, maybe Biden could still be Secretary of State under Clinton...
Reader Comments ( Page 1 of 3)
1. I agree with you wholeheartedly, Patrick. And this from Biden, who I'd always thought of as articulate and bright and clean and a nice-looking guy. I see that daily kos is calling him on it, too. Could be the Death Knell for a campaign that is, what, two days old?
david knowles at 12:03PM on Jan 31st 2007
2. Joe Biden has always been a very straight shooter, and speaks his mind. Although it is unlikely that he will garner the political support needed to win his party's nomination, he has helped the discourse of presidential politics by choosing to enter the race.
W L Najt at 6:48PM on Feb 7th 2007
3. Wow, do I agree with David Knowles! My words to myself exactly. I find these slips of the tongue too retro for the time(which is why I agree with Casey's statement. Below is quote from AOL source you might be interested in:
"Obama noted that he taught constitutional law for 10 years and rejected the notion that the congressional authorization for war in 2002 gives Bush "carte blanche to proceed in any way."
"The notion that as a consequence of that authorization, the president can continue down a failed path without any constraints from Congress whatsoever is wrong and is not warranted by our Constitution," Obama said in a 10-minute telephone call.
Obama said troops should be sent to three locations - home to the United States,.in countries around Iraq to prevent regional conflict and to Afghanistan , which he said is in danger of falling back to the Taliban."
Okay, now what do you guys recommend about how I should handle the hate e-mail I began receiving late last night from people who are scared to death that Obama could actually become their first Black President( I know; I already reported the SPAM to aol post haste when the first hater passed along to a second to take up the dunning this morning).
By the way that was the part that is retro about the Biden remark,slipping into referring to Obama as if he were Afro-American, which he might well be but not in the sense of his contemporaries in the Black Community such as Black Voices AOL.
madupont at 7:58PM on Jan 31st 2007
4. Barak Obama is from my state-Illinois. He has become arrogant, "know-it-all" and far above the crowd from which he came. Seemingly, he has forgotten that Illinoians are still farmers and are those that have willingly sent their sons and daughters to fight a war on Middle Eastern soil to protect us all from war on OUR soil. No one had better even contemplate cutting off funds to supply our military with vital equipment. How many years has Barak served...and for whom??? I think we've heard about enough from our rookie senator, on this subject. At least, I have!
Pat at 12:40PM on Jan 31st 2007
5. Democrat Presidential hopefuls, U.S. Senators Obama, Biden, Hagel, Levin "wake up" and "step out" of your political ambition politics, and "step up" to the reality of the War in Iraq. More U.S. military force is needed now. Listen to Adm. Fallon and see what is happening in the Middle East. Could you be so blinded by your political bias that you cannot see what the Iran Republic of Islam is doing? You are a shame to the U.S. military and the American people.
Alan Klaus at 1:29PM on Jan 31st 2007
6. The only hope for this country is Hillary and the "First Man" Bill, period.
Two Presidents for one vott is nothing more than priceless. Two people who can help lead us back to world respectability and adhereence to our Constitution.
I am extremely curious to see the names od each and ever Senator still backing our Preisdent who continues to operate on Auto-Idiot, and even more so I am curious to know the nemaes of everyone in Congress who continues to stall on the Minimum wage Bill.
2008 will bring out the disinfectant to completely clean not only the White HOuse but Congress as well.
E. Barnes at 3:07PM on Jan 31st 2007
7. There are two types of politics and two types of politicians. There are those who focus on pork and how much they can siphon off for the benefit of their constituency....be that constituency a geographical district or an ethnic group. And then there are those who seek to identify with and serve the national interest.
Many blacks, especially those who have made their living off the civil rights industry, are distressed that Obama is focused on the national interest rather than how much pork he can deliver for the black community, with possibly a slice for himself ala Congressman Jefferson or Jesse Jackson. From the perspective of the national interest, this style of "leader" is simply corrupt.
Obama may be too green at this point for the Presidency but he is at least on a path that could make him a national leader in future.
Cincinnati Rick at 7:06PM on Jan 31st 2007
8. Joe Biden is a good guy, who occasionally speaks without considering how it will sound to others. Who hasn't done that in their life.
But, he has a good heart, and would be a good candidate for President. I like him. He's experienced in politics, and he would be a 100x better for our country than W.
deb at 9:48PM on Feb 1st 2007
9. I'm sorry Cincinnati Rick but i disagree entirely with your opinion that "Many blacks, especially those who have made their living off the civil rights industry, are distressed that Obama is focused on the national interest rather than how much pork he can deliver for the black community". The concern is for social institutions to remain intact and effective and not for a group of people to be completely screwed over by governmental policy that only benefits the rich. The black community does not expect to reap the benefits of having a black president but they do expect that their corncerns and worries will better represented and addressed. if obama truly is focused on national interests then he'll be concerned with the overwhelming majority of us who don't have six figure jobs, which includes the black community.
sherri at 12:16AM on Feb 1st 2007
10. i hate when people point out that Obama doesn't have "the civil rights baggage" and won't fall back on the "blame whitey" sentiment that other politicians have. the fact of the matter is that history cannot be changed or erased and that the period in the United States from the late 60s and earlier had a very real affect on the lives of African Americanstoday. It's not a blame whitey mentality that people like Al Sharpton and Jesse Jackson express but a realistic outlook on what they see going on in the United States today. An overwhelming percentage of the impoverished are minorities and it cannot be denied that these people are the most underepresented politically. Not having any civil rights ties does not mean that obama won't connect with the Black community on many of the issues that are just exxagerated hold overs from earlier periods in this country's history. You can't hope that this one man will wash away all the wrongs that were inacted on an entire group of people for such along time.
anonymous at 12:09AM on Feb 1st 2007
11. Wow, how could a compliment go so wrong? I understand what Biden was getting at, but he couldn't have screwed it up more! How about words like youthful, positive, refreshing, inspiring - all words not applied to many politicians out there now being they black, white or purple! Sorry Charlie, insulting Jackson and Sharpton on top of it all really sunk your ship straight to the bottom. Could you imagine this guy in an international crisis? Probably would call someone an asshole! Goodbye. Farewell. Adios.
Lori Moir at 9:26AM on Feb 1st 2007
12. I DONT UNDERSTAND HOW PEOPLE USE RACIAL SLANG IN EVERY DAY TALKING,AND BECAUSE A MAN SAYS ANOTHER MAN IS" CLEAN " OMG! THATS RACIAL,LMAO!!! PEOPLE NEED TO GROW UP AND MAKE IT REAL. DRAMA IS DRAMA AND IT MAKES US AND OUR LIVES NOT WHAT IT SHOULD AND COULD BE.
SISSY at 11:07AM on Feb 1st 2007
13. Let me provide a clarification for Sherri's concerns. The national interest is more than merely the sum total of personal interests found in any society. There is always a tension between the national interest and that of individuals (and groups of individuals).
It also happens that, in purporting to represent the interests of a group (blacks, in this case) individuals may become "professionals" in so doing and, under cover of that activity, enrich themselves and their family/associates instead of (or out of all proportion to) the delivery of benefits to the group they claim to serve. In terms of the interests of the larger group, this personal enrichment is what we commonly call "corruption."
A very obvious example of corruption is the $90,000 in marked bills unearthed from Congressman Jefferson's freezer. But more subtle is the shakedowns of corporations by Jesse Jackson (and others in the Civil Rights industry) that have made him and his family wealthy. Fees are paid to (in the spirit of L. Ron Hubbard) get a "clear", or in a modern version of the practice condemned by Martin Luther, purchase an indulgence for one's sins...in this case, "sins" against the black community. (By contrast, not corrupt in form but merely a sharp and unseemly practice, is the manner in which the family of MLK are holding hostage for financial gain parts of his legacy and memorabilia).
The Civil Rights industry is hardly unique in this corruption...a wide range of "charitable" ventures share this characteristic. Money is solicited for a worthy cause but very little may get put to the purpose intended. While, in some cases, money is simply stolen, more commonly it is simply consumed by salaries, expenses and contracts with friends and controlled entities.
My point is that, thus far, Obama has had no connection with the Civil Rights industry and has framed his views solely in terms of the national interest or, if you prefer, the interests of all Americans. That includes the interests of blacks but does not emphasize or single them out in a way that the professional civil rights advocates do. Understandably, they have been wary of him as he could undercut their appeal and curtail the effectiveness of their business model.
Cincinnati Rick at 1:05PM on Feb 1st 2007
14. I find it amazing that anyone could defend racist remarks. I realize that "some" people don't understand what it feels like to be discriminated against.If you never been discrimintaed against because of race, you would never understand how comments like this hurt to the very core of someone's soul. Barack Obama is not perfect and neither is Jo Biden, but ask yourself does he (Obama)deserve to be described as a 'clean', (nice looking guy),so what is he saying, that African-Americans are dirty. Whites,Blacks,Latinos and Asians. Please understand this..... most people have sterotypical views...most of us keep them hidden until we are in a situation where we feel comfortable to express them.....or you slip up and show your true feelings....This is what happened to Jo Biden...he may be a nice guy,but this is how he views African-Americans...bottom line..
a onequestion? If about an established, educated What peoplewho have never been discriminated against
Kim at 1:09PM on Feb 1st 2007
15. It is sad to see smart, well educated people, well intended, with ideas to become "President" and then start giving speeches without thinking, without a heart, with out "Golden Rules". A President for this great country should have a BIG Heart, before you send young people to battle, think about a Mother, about a Father, About a Wife, about Children, how can you send to war all these people when you are a draft dodger?
Your opinions about other candidates are of no importance, categorizing with week knowledge and historical ignorance, just makes us believe that candidates have to remember that stupidity is not a virtue, and it will never be, it does not matter how many times you try.
Peter Schwarz at 2:11PM on Feb 1st 2007