In their fantasy world, we wouldn't have lost Iraq if Harry Reid didn't say the magic words. Reality has a way of sneaking up on you no matter how hard you try to avoid it. We would be losing the Iraq War even if no one said a word about it (which they didn't for a painfully long time -- and as we saw, that didn't make it any better).
Are Republicans now telling us that somehow we are going to pull Iraq back together, the Shia and the Sunni are going to start co-existing peacefully, the Sunnis are going to stop fighting even though they are not represented by the government, everyone is going to share the oil equitably without concern for their own sects, the Shia in Iraq are not going to work with the Shia in Iran and that democracy will flourish in Iraq just like George Bush promised us?
How much crack do you have to be on to believe that? I don't believe that anyone actually believes that fantasy. Not even the hardest right-wing man on the planet is that deluded. People are just arguing for the sake of arguing now. They have the "R" painted on the side of their helmet and they're just playing politics because they don't want their team to lose. But no one in their right mind believes we are going to be able to put Iraq back together again. So, Harry Reid was the first to say that. God bless him.
I don't believe the Republicans are even trying to win this war anymore. I think they are desperately trying to figure out a way to pin the defeat on the Democrats. Their main strategy is to pretend we could have won if the Democrats didn't make us pull out. They think that strategy worked in pinning fault on the Democrats in Vietnam, so they're trying it again.
As I wrote earlier, here's the reality:
"Let's get this straight - once and for all. It was a Republican president, a Republican administration, a Republican Senate, a Republican House and entirely Republican government that started and lost the war in Iraq. No excuses. They screwed this thing up entirely. It is 100% their fault.
Now that we have lost in Iraq, I think the country would be better off listening to the Democrats on how to extricate us from this mess. But I will not stand by and watch Democrats get blamed for losing Iraq when Iraq is already lost.
Why am I so adamant about this? Is it because I am a lifelong Democrat and an incurable partisan? No, I was a Republican until Bush invaded Iraq. My party loyalty has been to the Republicans for almost my entire life. No, it must be made clear that the Republicans lost Iraq because if it is not clear, the country might be deluded into believing them again."
Don't fall for this obvious political trick. To paraphrase Colin Powell: If they broke it, they own it.The Young Turks
Reader Comments ( Page 1 of 2)
1. If our "war czar" and his VP "war profiteer had put the slightest thought into this before they barged in and upset the apple cart, removed the Sunni buffer to Iran, and killed of a pile of people while in the process alienating the whole world - we wouldn't be in this mess. Its time for the donkey to clean up the Elephant's mess.
Phil at 2:22PM on Apr 20th 2007
2. Where did America go? Imagine your neighborhood controlled by the mafia or worse the Democratic party. Both will threaten and then take your money. Both will claim to prtect you then sell you out to the highest bidder. Or worse leave you to die. You Democrates have all the answers and usually well after the conflict... You all should be ashamed!
scott at 4:09PM on Apr 20th 2007
3. nettacbme,
Don't be so hard on "scott." He/She probably still thinks Saddam was responsible for 9-11 because our president told him so and that WMD's have been found and that the intelligence that led to the war wasn't cooked. He/She is, in short, a fantasist. Links follow:
thinkprogress.org/2006/08/21/bush-on-911/
http://www.guardian.co.uk/Iraq/Story/0,2763,1184172,00.html
lil_turk at 5:57PM on Apr 20th 2007
4. Senator Reid should be ashamed of himself for such treasonous remarks while our troops are in harms way. It's this Senator & his ilk that will have these Muslim facists attacking America again, because they know the Democrats are weak when it comes to war & are the true appeasers. When those butchers come ashore in this Country again I hope Reid, Kennedy & Clinton are the first to go.
Joan Squitieri at 6:11PM on Apr 20th 2007
5. 500.00 phil. reid is another toyko rose,she didnt get shot for treason, but he along with pelosi,t.kennedy and mrs. bill clinton should! at the least life in prison w/o parole.
steve england at 8:01PM on Apr 20th 2007
6. Poster #5's comments:
"Senator Reid should be ashamed of himself for such treasonous remarks while our troops are in harms way."
"When those butchers come ashore in this Country again I hope Reid, Kennedy & Clinton are the first to go."
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So... it's treason to have the cahones to speak a less than desirable but obvious truth for all to hear, but not treason to openly yearn for the merciless slaughter of members of our own government because they speak their minds? If someone threatened your right to say that, would you cry first amendment? If someone said that about a republican would you call them a traitor?
Let's be clear on this treason crap. Here's the wikipedia entry, just because it's convenient:
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In law, treason is the crime of disloyalty to one's nation. A person who betrays the nation of their citizenship and/or reneges on an oath of loyalty and in some way willfully cooperates with an enemy, is considered to be a traitor. Oran's Dictionary of the Law (1983) defines treason as: "...[a]...citizen's actions to help a foreign government overthrow, make war against, or seriously injure the [parent nation]." In many nations, it is also often considered treason to attempt or conspire to overthrow the government, even if no foreign country is aided or involved by such an endeavour.
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Hmm.. wikipedia must be a liberal conspiracy; they left out the part where it says that questioning authority or merely voicing an opposing opnion amounts to treason. They should have fired ALL the federal prosecutors! None of them were pursuing treason cases, and we are clearly surrounded by traitors! Bring the troops home, we need them here! It's a traitor insurgency! Ahhhhhh!
And so, NEITHER of those statements is treasonous. Not Harry Reid's and not Miss Squitieri's. Because they are words, and in no way betray the nation or a sworn oath. I could be wrong, does the swearing-in process involve an oath of blind loyalty to the executive? Now, if Harry Reid is selling assault weapons to Al-Qaeda, or divulging nuclear weapons secrets to North Korea, let's cuff him. Otherwise, let the man speak and if you are one of the 30% of hangers-on to that sinking ship on the rocky Kennebunkport coastline, try responding with something other than hate, fear, and self-deception. You might as well stick your index fingers in your ears and shout LALALALALA! It achieves the same end.
Tyson at 8:26PM on Apr 20th 2007
7. In regards to scott's comments...It sounds like you think we should just send more 20yr olds out there to die. And for what? For a war that should never have been in Iraq. Iraq did not bomb us, it was Osama BinLaden. The whole war has gone off track. At least democrats are trying to save lives, unlike the republicans.
nettacbme at 8:41PM on Apr 20th 2007
8. Hey Cenk,
Odd that some of your big name "think alikes", Rosie O'Donnell, The Dixie Chicks, Sean Penn and Madonna didn't drop a line or two here. You, Hollywood and Vegas have some real time opinions.
Willet at 8:45PM on Apr 20th 2007
9. Both Party the Republican and Democrat need to cool down their rhetoric and finger pointing instead fix the Iraqi problem together.We have a noisy Congress with not much done except for investigation after investigation,it's investigation without end.Whatever situation we find ourselves in Iraq,it's pointless to continue argue about it but rather come up with a united solution thats better for Iraq and for the early return home of our service men and women.Don't let politics and pride to stand in the way of doing what is best and reasonable in accomplishing a peaceful end for Iraq and for the World.
Kava Mulipola at 9:31PM on Apr 20th 2007
10. Change your name to the young turds you talk a lot of crap. Young people are fighting and losing thier lifes. while you and the demi rat lib"s give comfort and aid hope to thier killers. I for one of many have seen your kind of wars. Draft them killem just a bunch of white trash and blacks. Harry Reid LBJ your all the same everyone of you suck....
average joe at 9:36PM on Apr 20th 2007
11. It's time to save face. Senator Reid is mistaken. But he is not alone. A whole lot of you are just as mistaken as well. The fact of the matter is we won the Iraq war. Let me say that again. WE WON THE IRAQ WAR.
But let's talk peace. We are not going to win that. Make no mistake about it. War? No problem. But who in their right mind believed that we were going to establish a peace over there? We're talking about a peace that has been nonexistent over there for several hundred years. And we were going to accomplish that feat in what amount of time!? Somebody has a screw loose.....51 cards in the deck.....5 of 8 cylinders firing.
We won the war. Now let's get the hell out of there because we're not going to win the peace.
Derek Pointer at 9:37PM on Apr 20th 2007
12. I was very leery of going to war with Iraq. As a Vietnam veteran I became very concerned when I heard the Bush Administration say that we were going to use “Shock and Awe” tactics, and that the whole thing would be over in a month. Whenever a politician tells you that a war is going to be over in a month, you know they are underestimating the enemy. The very same thing happened in Vietnam.
Our congress and senate gave the president the power to wage this war as part of the response to the attacks of September 11, 2001. Because of this it cannot be labeled as a Democrat or Republican thing. It is an American thing! Rightly or wrongly, we started the war in Iraq and we must finish it.
There is a little restaurant that I patronize just outside of Green Bay, WI. In the restaurant there is a framed picture of a young lady in an Army uniform. She used to work as a waitress in the restaurant. She was a reservist who was called up when this thing started. She was also one of the first women killed in Iraq. Her picture haunts me. What if she were my daughter? How would I then feel about losing this war?
Many more of the finest young people America has to offer have been killed since her death; and yet, all we talk about here at home is how we need to give-up and quit. How we need to stop the money that supports the war and leave our troops stranded on the sands of defeat.
We can quit now. But doing so would liken us to Cho Seung-Hui, the mass murderer of Blacksburg, Virginia. Our actions will have been no better. We will have killed legions of young people for fallacious reason. Our politicians, of both parties, have led the American people on this course of action. They steal our money and now they are killing our kids. They can have the money, but they better make the deaths of our children count for something! God help them if they don’t.
Fight or die.
Maxx Foxx
Maxx Foxx at 10:12PM on Apr 20th 2007
13. Sen.Reid & anyone else who believes that the Middle East is not a REAL & DIRE threat to this country are blithering Idiots...Do you think the guys on those airplanes that did 9/11 were from Nebraska or maybe a Brownie Troup from Iowa?
Amazing how soon they forget & start criticizing.
What would all the critic have done on the day we were hit? Haven't heard anyone say?
LaVonne at 10:43PM on Apr 20th 2007
14. It is amazing how soon FACTS are twisted and forgotten. As for those guys on the airplane that did 9/11? Not from Iraq. NOT ONE.
What would I have done after 9/11? I would have gone after the mastermind behind 9/11. And I think that we did that (half-heartedly).
But who would like to show their stupidity and step up to suggest that Saddam was behind 9/11? Raise your hand. Take one step forward. (Besides you Mr. President.)
Derek Pointer at 11:21PM on Apr 20th 2007
15. My dad told me many years ago.....son, don't fool yourself, everything comes down to 2 things in life saddly...."money" and "power".....
Everyone fights these wars in the name of "religion" or "peace".....what a joke.....I agree with the poster above.....there ain't ever gonna be peace because every nation seems to hide behind "their God, be it God, Allah, whomever"....
All of that is ludicrous....If there is a God or Allah out there....would he/she/it want these wars??....Hell no....They would want peace .....
The easiest way to justify these conflicts/wars is to "say" you are fighting for freedom and all....in my opinion, its all crap....
These are human beings making these decisions and they are and have been deciding to do them in the name of "God or Allah, etc".....what they are really doing is wanting POWER and MONEY.....which in effect is GREED....these are the real sins....
I guess I am too idealistic to think that the Buddhist way of peace and tranquility would ever happen world-wide.....that would be too amazing....
Look at Israel and Palestine....I admit I don't know many or all of the facts, but they have been killing each other on a "daily basis" for what, 90 years??....All in the name of religions, which, those type of religions seem to preach or instill "fear and alienation" in people....Just listen to preachers, sermons from almost ALL denominations.....they always talk about ...."watch out", "be careful", "WE are the chosen people"..."give your money and you'll live a better life".....They preach FEAR and HATRED of other people that don't believe or live their teachings.....how SELF-CENTERED and righteous is that crap??
Well, everyone wants to point fingers here in the USA about its Bush's fault, its the liberals fault......we're all to blame.....The French funnelled money by selling weapons to Iraq....The Germans think they have all the answers.....The Israeli's are the HOLY LAND, yet wage war on a daily basis.....We here in the USA are the richest, yet have extreme poverty and SHADINESS beyond belief in our Corporate structure and Government.....
NOBODY is exempt.....there is enough blame (and has been) for a LONG time world-wide.....The more each nation "separates, divides and THINKS they will conquer".....the more each nation is really just fooling themselves.....
Thousands were lost in the 9-11 attacks.....now thousands more have been lost in the Iraqi conflict.....and what will be the result??...Just thousands of people lost.....NO WINNERS.....think about it....
In the Israeli - Palestinian conflict for DECADES, there have been thousands killed in all fashions each year....and have we named a WINNER yet????
NOPE..........
Hoosierwynn at 12:36PM on Apr 21st 2007