1. Michael Moore is an IDIOT! He is so typical of a fanantical liberal, they run their mouth and pick and choose and twist the facts to serve their purpose. then they go on TV. and if someone disagrees with them they talk and shout over them to keep the viewers from hearing other facts and views.MICHAEL MOORE IS NOTHING MORE THAN A LOUD MOUTH FAT ASS WHO CARES ONLY ABOUT HIS OWN SELF AND GETTING ATTENTION THAN THE PEOPLE HE CLAIMS TO BE HELPING.

michael at 11:33PM on Jul 10th 2007

2. Gupta is from an elitist cast system in India; his family is at the top of the food chain there. His families cast literally walk over lower people dying in the street. Moore may be quirky but he is for the American little guy. With baby boomers turning 65 - you do not want someone like Gupta making life and death decisions for you. By the way - if he is such a great doctor why throw your medical career away for a TV gig? Answer - fame, fortune, hot models to bang. Yeah...Gupta is a regular Vishu (or Saint) whichever you prefer. Keep yelling at people Michael Moore! Someone has to do it!!!

john at 11:39PM on Jul 10th 2007

3. If you listen to Gupta his whole case is that Moore did not have his facts right. Then Gupta states his example that Moore wrongly stated that Cuban medical cost per year per person are $25. He later admits that Moore never said this and he made a mistake. Game over Gupta you don't have your facts right.

Rob at 12:08AM on Jul 11th 2007

4. john attacks the messenger instead of the message...if you have an intelligent argument let's here it! I for one think both arguments have credibility. Unfortunately Mr. Moores arguments leave out all the facts that detract from his position. The real problem is ALL the politicians not just one Party. They are all closing there eyes to the abuse of the insurance companies. Also, as Americans we like the availability of very expensive hi tech devices whereas many areas of the world simply don't supply such services.

jerry at 12:11AM on Jul 11th 2007

5. I don't know whether Michael Moore is right or wrong. But he gets us talking. It's not pretty when we have to look at ourselves in the mirror without any bias. I think he makes us take a good hard look at things. I don't agree with some of the stuff he says and he came across as a whiner on Larry King. However, we need people like Moore in our society to keep checks and balances in play. I think Coulter does the same thing as Moore does via literature. So, as trashy as I think she is, we need that poison too.

sam at 12:14AM on Jul 11th 2007

6. Gupta kept saying "yeah, I get it" when trying to deflect any points Moore made.

What is it you "get," Sanjay? That our medical insurance is increasingly only for those who have money to afford to get sick? Or that you could care less and want to trot out some tired "tax" argument.

Do you really think that the word tax so salivates fury in Americans that you can win any argument just by uttering it? There are certain things Americans would like our taxes to go to. Health care for everyone would definitely be on the top of MY list.

Sanjay Gupta came off as an elitist, overpaid, arrogant fool.

Dawn at 12:38AM on Jul 11th 2007

7. Iloved this debate, and I hope people will continue to talk until there is resolution. I would like to see more of this on CNN. As for who won the debate...well, Gupta is cuter and classier than MM, and Gupta conceded to many of MM comments. So on looks...Gupta! :) But Thank YOU MM, for bringing this issue to the forefront. As a nurse, I see things everyday that are affronts to our sensibilities and offensive to the character of the American people. Healthcare cannot continue as it is, for the simple act of living is being offered to those who can afford to pay. As a nurse, it is AGAINST my code of professional ethics to receive any form of gratuity to provide my services...and that is how is should be for hospitals and physicians alike. By treating every one of my patients as equals, regardless of payment methods (I never know who is PP and who is MC/MD, HMO or insured)I am able to give each of my patients the best care that I can deliver. Physicians are offered "tips" in the form of bonuses when they reduce the healthcare costs of insured members. They also receive "perks" from pharmaceutical companies to market certain prescriptions when there may be something less expensive to offer. To be fair to physicians, they are being compensated at increasinly lower rates for their services and their costs are skyrocketing. Even the most ethical of physicians would be forced into playing this game of bonus compensation and perks just to continue his practice...but in a system where there were no tips, gratuities, or bonuses...whatever term you may use, every patient would receive the same dedicated care from their physician...as he receives no bonuses to treat anyone differently. I have personally witnessed MC/MD patients waiting in the waiting room for their appointments while those with better insurance are seen before them. The Dr. "squeezes' in the goverment patients in between those wil the best healthcare plans. The receptionist simply tell the MC/MD patient that the doctor is running behind. In a system where every American is treated with the same dignity and respect, the order of arrival and appointment time would dictate who would be seen first. I have also seen patients discharged from the hospital with prescriptions they cannot afford...and while the "free" drug programs are wonderful, it can take 3-6 months to actually receive the drug. By then the disease may have progressed beyond the benefit of the medication. So to those who say there is a wait for services in other countries...well there is a wait here as well. The difference being that in other countries the wait is based on acuity of the illness and NOT the ability to pay. I have seen underinsured people discharged from the hospital in what my opinion is incomplete care. For those people, waiting is not an issue...they received minimum services in favor of those who are insured. I have hundreds of horror stories to tell about today's health system, but until we make dramatic and radical changes, those stories, and the stories of many others will become just another day. All of us have a responsibility to each other. If more of us took that responsibility a bit more seriously, America would truly be an awesome place to live. No person in this USA should have to worry if they can buy health or simply even life. I work in healthcare and I pay nearly $600.00 per month for my coverage...and I do not have complete faith that it would be effective if I had a catastrophic illness. I am a single mother who can ill-afford this coverage...but I have no choice. I do find it ironic that as I go to work each day and care for others, I have to wonder if I will be able to be cared for when I or my children are in need. And even with insurance, the co-pays alone for a major illness and subsequent prescriptions would bankrupt me, or force me to choose between my medication or rent, or food. That is the sad reality of our system, and why it needs to be out of the hands of profiteers and into a management system that compensates the healthcare workers...nurses, Drs, and all fairly and equitably, and without additional compensatation based on quality of care. Furthermore, all profits made from any healthcare system should be re-invested in research and modern medical facilities to ensure continued quality of care. And just a thought...I wonder if many of the people who are termed "disabled" and receiving benefits would be able to be contributing members of out society if only they had access to medications that might enable them to lead a productive life? It is a myth that people on disability have all their medical expenses covered. I know of a patient who has had multiple hospital admissions for mental illness, and it is always the same...he is discharged as a stable, healthy individual and returns because he alone cannot afford the mood stabilizing and psychotropic medications he needs to function. It may suprise you to know he was once a professor at a local university. His life has been destroyed because he cannot function without medications, and he does not have access to all the medications he needs...a mind is a terrible thing to waste. So is life.

Charisse at 12:47AM on Jul 11th 2007

8. Yikes, Sanjay Gupta got smoked. I got to see the list that was conveniently covered up by the CNN logo. For shame, CNN. I do wish that Moore was more calm during debates and stopped snickering. But as far as facts, Gupta needs to work harder and stop making false assertions that "he did fudge the numbers".

BTW, Gupta saying that he researches who his guests are didn't bother with the basic lists:
http://www.newsmeat.com/fec/bystate_detail.php?city=BRENTWOOD&st=TN&last=Keckley

Danno at 12:56AM on Jul 11th 2007

9. Gupta got it right: Michael Moore cherry picks his facts. He always has. He always will. It's his nature. He's not making movies to inform - they are NOT documentaries. He makes movies to persuade - they are propaganda. When pressed he sometimes admits this, though he doesn't seem to mind if someone calls his works documentaries. But when people hear his work described as a "documentary" by others - reporters, critics, supporters of Moore's views - then they tend to take his constructs as factual.

RE: SICKO - Health care, as an issue, is argued with statistics, mainly because(like baseball) there are so many of them. Moore's m.o. is to take some of his figures from "Source A" that bolster one part of his case but then use figures from "Source B" that are more friendly than Source A's would be to another part of his case. That IS cherry-picking the facts. It makes me think that, early on in his carreer he was just too lazy to expend the effort to get his facts organized. But he's stumbled onto a brilliant formula here: his use of "factoids" is very persuasive on an EMOTIONAL level, giving viewers the FEELING that they're being persuaded by "the facts." He is the left coast's Leni Riefenstahl. And that's a compliment.

OhLuckyMan at 1:39AM on Jul 11th 2007

10. There wasn't supposed to be a winner/loser to this discussion. What sort of bothered me was that Michael Moore was more preoccupied with coming out of this discussion as a winner than he was in coming up with a balanced solution. I applaud Gupta for remaining level-headed and classy throughout the DISCUSSION.

I too am glad Michael Moore has brought this discussion to light. And he's right in many ways. But folks, he's pushing socialized medicine. It's not nearly the utopian solution he suggests. Hospital wait times are terrible, despite what stats he throws at you. The quality of the health services doesn't hold a candle to the US--the technology and expertise of American doctors is second-to-none in this world and it's because the system isn't socialized.

The current system is one extreme. Moore's view is the opposite extreme. I believe it's always important to look at the balanced perspective. So yes, we should all pay attention to Sicko, but also be sure to watch "Dead Meat" (a documentary about the problems with Canadian health care) and be sure to read Kurt Loder's fantastic critique of Sicko.

Jon at 9:27AM on Jul 11th 2007

11. Oh Michael Moore is an IDIOT? So, does that mean there WERE WMD's in Iraq? The Bush Administration did NOT lie? Our health care system is among the world's best? I guess you have to be a "fanatical liberal" to see the media's negligence in keeping this runaway administration in check. I guess you have to be a "conservative wacko" to write what I saw in post #1

Bruce Margolis at 8:29AM on Jul 11th 2007

12. For that Micheal Moore to even consider Cuba's healthcare system a health care system a joke. Me having family in Cuba can tell you that in Cuba to get painkillers for your family, family members from overseas have to ship them because they are just not available for the citizens of Cuba. However most everyday medication which are'nt available to the citizens of cuba are available in tourist centers where the citizens of Cuba are not are not allowed to shop in. And the so called health care syatem is limited to some cubans, the prisoners, mostly political dissidents are often denied medical treatment. Micheal Moore missed out on those and many more injustices of the regime in the debate.

Brian at 8:51AM on Jul 11th 2007

13. I am so sick of people bad mouthing eachother and only being able to respond to a different opinion through name-calling! Thank you Charisse for some insight from a nurse's point of view.
I also don't love MM and his immature way of getting his point across BUT who but he is trying to do something about it? Our government is a mess. They can't help the people who they represent because it's all about power and party. I am disgusted with the Republicans AND the Democrats!
To be 37th (we all agree on this fact) in the world in terms of quality healthcare is shameful! The reason we Americans don't want to pay more taxes is because the money goes for the wrong things and to the wrong people. Our finest minds should all be working for the government so we could finally start to fix some of our huge problems. I applaud MM for bringing up these problems. Now let's stop calling eachother names and tell...no demand our elected officials to do something about it!!!

Jeri at 9:32AM on Jul 11th 2007

14. Michael Moore has always specialized in hyperbolic, shrill criticism of everything American. Certainly our health care system is flawed in many ways and is subject to both scrutiny and criticism in an effort to sincerely reform those things which are wrong. Moore is not interested in reforming American health care. His agenda is to replace American republican democracy with socialism. He clearly holds up such paragons of human rights as Fidel Castro and Ahmadinejad as templates for the kind of leadership that will help Americans attain the kind of society he sees as ideal. It is a red herring to think that reforming health care, an issue that all people of good faith would agree needs attention, should be part of a larger crusade to restructure America to the extreme and outdated social utopias in the last vestige of communism or the fanatic world of extreme islam. After all I am sure if one were to analyze some of the policies of Hitler and Mussolini one could find many isolated policies with which one could agree. Would it, therefore lead to a recommedation that facism would cure our social and political ills? Moore's agenda is not to fix individual issues but to demonize America's political and social structures while idealizing those of countries which none of us would for one second consider living in including Mr. Moore.

eric at 9:50AM on Jul 11th 2007

15. Gupta wasted our time, the same way CNNdid three years ago with Fahrenheit 911. Ultimately, the WMD were "fictional" and those who smeared the critics of the war have not apologized.

Now we see a bunch of fools saying Moore is wrong the same day President Bush made a speech in Ohio advocating changes necessary in the system. Are you deaf or just ignorant? The very leader you claim to defend wants to change the system.

The real question is will we continue with a private sector program or move toward some government involvement? Odds are pretty good with so much waste in our private-sector-based healthcare system (the most expensive in the world) that government is going to have to disappoint the medical lobby, which has had its way for too long.

profebc at 11:35PM on Jul 12th 2007