16. Incidently, in the 1950's Gus Hall and the American communist party extolled the virtues of Stalinist communism and called the USSR an ongoing socialist experiment that would eventually lead to a communist utopia. The Russians referred to Hall and American communists as useful idiots. I think that is an apt description for Moore nd those sycophants who admire him.

eric at 10:06AM on Jul 11th 2007

17. Let's all focus on calling Michael Moore names.

Let's all focus on which fact he might be a hair off.
Then we don't have to face the central point of his movie. A society is judged by what it has done for those most in need. We abandon our elderly, mentally ill, sick and in need. We claim that it is their fault. I hear and read people say - "If they could just get over whatever it is and get a good job they wouldn't be in this situation." "Maybe this is a way a society can get rid of the weaker loosers."

We actually endorse a national practice of making money off the weak and ill. Just look at the Wall Street dollars being made off your medical needs. When that hospital asprin costs you $25.00 remember there are a lot of stock holders that have to be fed off that charge. We endorse blood money -- keeping open emergency rooms that "make a profit."

Check - how many hospitals in your area are owned by stock holders. Then check on how the others are pushed around to deal with the demands of their profit making competition. How many religious and public hospitals have been pushed to financal distress or ruin because of the profit sector control of the hospitals in your area. Just give it a shot and find out - There are some "facts" for you to check.

Next time you wait for care in an emergency room remember that a major portion of your wait is taken by a larger number of staff checking to make sure you emergency will be covered than working on your medical condition.

Oh you religious faithful! SHAME ON YOU. You want to claim this is a religous nation -- name ONE religion that supports the principle of blaming the victim and charging the weak and helpless.

I have insurance -- THANK GOD. But, how I worry about all of you out there who are working hard and will face financial ruin when a medical condition takes all your savings and your home. ( medical costs one of the leading causes of bankruptcies -- check that fact and if it is not exactly correct,[it is] then know ONE bankruptcy because of medical need is a shame!)

I am a Doctor who left the system because I could no longer afford to fight for my patients and stand by and watch them suffer needlessly. Don't worry, we quietly drift away and no one notices. But, make no mistake about -- some day YOU WILL.

Tom at 10:22AM on Jul 11th 2007

18. I think Michael Moore won the debate. Gupta was basically cherry picking his sources to count MM points and I think he did himself a bad favour. he really looked defensive and bad.

Anthony at 11:26AM on Jul 11th 2007

19. Tom, I am not for one moment saying that our health care system isn't riddled with problems. Do you really think that socialized medicine is the answer? If you do I think you should speak to people In Canada or the Uk who deal with having to wait for routine care for so long that their health problems which could have been dealt with, become major crises. There is a more reasonable and equitable solution in dealing with our problems then radically restructuring our society. I think that consensus building requires us to be honest about our goals. Is it more important to fix health care or to "fix" the inequities of society by instituting draconian political and social changes that will reconstitute our way of life.

eric at 10:52AM on Jul 11th 2007

20. They used to say that the government was only good at waging war and killing people. After seeing what bureaucracy can do over and over again whether it's in Iraq or with disasters like Katrina, who in the hell thinks government can federalize healthcare? Back when I was a kid 25 years ago, government was paying $500 for toilet seats and hammers, just think how much you're going to pay as a tax payer for all of the contraceptives for all of the illegal aliens' 12 year old daughters!
There is no such thing as a free lunch- and don't think for a minute that you're missing much by not having socialized medicine like Cuba, Kenya, Britain, Ireland. I would honestly rather patronize an animal doctor than go to a hospital in many of these socialized utopias!

Mike at 10:49AM on Jul 11th 2007

21. Jeff Hoard and his idol Michael Moore are both loons and liars.

CNN had the audacity to point out that "Sicko" is dishonest leftist propaganda at which point Moore blew a gasket and began ranting and raving about everything under the sun except the topic at hand - his dishonest movie. When you're a leftist nut and even CNN feels they must call you out on your dishonesty you've obviously crossed the line.

Robert Byngham at 10:52AM on Jul 11th 2007

22. A message to your first post - Michael Moore, John Stewart, Bill Mahr are all bright, sharp, perceptive minds in their own collective respect. Unfortunately, however, their message is lost in the delivery (comedic satire). They're reduced to entertainers/entertainment - and not taken seriously.

There's a new (proverbial) kid in e-town. Instead of just complaining and/or outing a particular problem this movement is about to challenge American complacency with proactive, patriotic participation:

www.SharpElbows.com

Confrontation and controversy will become the norm until change and reform take place on the political and greed structured corporate home-front(s).

SharpElbows.com at 11:34AM on Jul 11th 2007

23. I think Michael Moore should be taken outside and shot in the head and his family should be billed the cost of the bullet. Along with that Same thing with all the politicians whatever polictial party they belong to shoot all the bastards and get new people.

Exitus12 at 11:39AM on Jul 11th 2007

24. Did anyone else notice how rapidly Dr. Gupta was blinking? It seemed to be about once per second, if not more. I was wondering because I have read about blinking as an indication of truthfulness, or lack thereof.

Lisa Brodyaga at 1:08PM on Jul 11th 2007

25. As a Canadian living in the States for several years, I can tell you that I spend a disproportionate amount of time talking with friends and family back home complaining about the health care system down here. There are a lot of things I love about living down here (otherwise I would go back home), but the one that makes absolutely NO sense to me is why otherwise intelligent Americans think that paying for profit in a private health care system (so that of every health care dollar spent, more than 50 cents goes to administration costs and profits for private corporations and shareholders) provides better health care. It simply doesn't.
I've spent literally whole days waiting in clinics and ERs (and I'm lucky; I have decent insurance), that would have been a simple, quick visit to a neighborhood clinic or hospital back home. On the weekends, my choices are two clinics in an entire giant city that close at 5pm (not to mention the out-of-pocket co-pay)! Back home, there would be several 24-hour clinics to choose from, all within walking distance or a short drive - an no out-of-pocket expenses.
Which would you rather have?
Right now, I'm waiting to get in to see a specialist (for something for which I was in the ER for 14 hours over the weekend), and can't get anyone to see me until later this week. At home, this would have been a complete non-issue.
I simply don't understand why an advanced nation like the United States insists on lining the pockets of HMOs, the pharmaceutical industry and wealthy shareholders, instead of providing fair, equal access to quality care.
I know. I've lived under both systems. And the US health care system is the worst thing about this otherwise great country.

Heather at 12:37PM on Jul 11th 2007

26. I have read reports suggesting that there are long waits for surgery under the Candian health system.
Twice, here in Canada in the last twenty years, I have required surgery. In each case I received prompt, caring and effective treatment. I think my case is typical. I have not heard of anyone who had a long wait for urgent medical treatment. I think it is fair to say that the majority of people in Canada, France, Germany, Italy, Spain and other countries would not want their universal health care system for everybody to be replaced. Few of this majority are Socialists whatever that much abused smear, which is used to freeze rational discusion, means. Eric

eric Greenwood at 4:39PM on Jul 11th 2007

27. I just caught the tail end. Looked mostly like show business. The rich {all of them} living off our naivety. Same as Cuba, where the ruling regime hasn't had to live without anything. Just the elitest Cubans {here stateside}, depriving the same people they deprived while living in Cuba.
Wake up, 'World Family'.

Carlo at 1:07PM on Jul 11th 2007

28. It seems only fair that such a polarizing issue has had that exact effect on the users of this forum. Of course MM is a blowhard who packages his message for maximum shock value. Of course Dr. Gupta abandoned the healing arts to earn better bucks talking about the healing arts. But the fact remains that we face hard choices as a result of the evolution of the medical profession in this country. In the "good old days" of fee-for-service medicine, Doctors controlled the care given to their patients and were solely responsible for medical outcomes. Fast forward to modern times where advances in medical technology expose us to fantastic diagnostic and treatment advances. These drugs and machines come with hefty price tags, often out of reach for the common patient. This created enough heat to establish the insurance industry as a significant player in medical care. The fear that we may not be able to afford these miracles of science if the need ever arises has caused most of us to arrange our lives to support our need for insurance. It seems that any attempt to correct the problem in the recent past has only made it worse. HMO's, PPO's, etc., came about with the thinking that large groups could negotiate better rates and therefore reduce costs. Ultimately, they became middle-men with their hands out, taking their slice of the medical dollar while doing little to reduce costs or increase quality of care. It is this extra tier that exacerbates the problem. And it is the government that initiated and then supported it. I hope the time comes when doctors take back the medical profession and run the insurance industry out of their business. I don't want my doctor putting my medical care on hold while he waits for insurance company approval for treatment he recommends.

Waterboy at 1:13PM on Jul 11th 2007

29. Hmmm....WMD's did anyone read the book by the Iraqi Air Force general? Bush lied is such a misnomer...I guess everybody that read those same reports lied? There were absolutely no terrorist or al-queda cells operating out of Iraq until after we invaded....yeah right!

Let's see MM not mixing up facts, 9/11 was full of "facts" that were not factual and for a guy who doesn't speak in sound bites....it seems if you watch his movies he takes snippets of what people say and make a whole new "fact" out of it. At best his propaganda...oh I mean non biased documentaries....are disingeniuous...at worst patently false. Look at Roger and Me, he neglects to tell you that he spoke with Roger Smith twice. He also tends to ignore the facts that don't support his hypothesis. Like 9/11....I didn't see him interview Duncan Hunter, whose son happens to be a marine in Iraq/Afghanistan theaters? Why not MM?

Maybe we should look at the French that MM is so fond of, they just elected a conservative, maybe the people got tired of the cradle to grave mentality and did not like paying 70% taxes, which was the US's top tax bracket back until Reagan. The economy was great and we received so many more services under Carter, Nixon, Kennedy(who happened to lower the top rate from 90% to 70%).

We need to overall the entitlement program not create a new one. Keep this in mind the government runs the Post Office....

Rick at 1:24PM on Jul 11th 2007

30. "To call Moore's work crap is to forever demean the truly excremental". Noted liberal intellectual, Christopher Hitchins.

twann9852 at 1:57PM on Jul 11th 2007