Even if God's existence could be proven, Niezsche writes in The Antichrist, we would still refuse to accept him. When I read atheists like Richard Dawkins and Christopher Hitchens, I don't get the impression that they are motivagted by mere unbelief. I don't believe in unicorns, but I don't go around writing books full of rejection and bile about unicorns. When I read The God Delusion and God Is Not Great, I see that their authors do not so much disbelieve in God as they hate Him.
Consequently, the arguments spelled out in these atheist books are out of sync with the actual vehemence of their authors.
Enter the French atheist Michel Onfray, whose Atheist Manifesto is a bestseller in Europe. Onfray comes out of a different tradition than Dawkins and Hitchens, one that he describes as stretching from the Baron d'Holbach to Nietzsche. This is Continental atheism, and it makes its case against God in an entirely different way than do the Anglo-Saxon atheists we encounter in the United States. Onfray, like Nietzsche, regards Anglo-Saxon atheists like Dawkins as representing a low, brutish type, widely found in England.
These themes will be developed in my forthcoming book What's So Great About Christianity. But here's one key difference between Anglo-Saxon atheism and Continental atheism. While Dawkins and Hitchens insist that we can be moral without God, Onfray with astonishing frankness concedes Nietzsche's point that the death of God also means the death of Western morality and Western values. So if God goes, that means that "equality" and "rights" go too. This is a possibility that Dawkins and Hitchens have not even considered. In many ways I think Onfray's atheism is more honest, more darkly appealing, and more dangerous than the atheism of Dawkins and Hitchens. My review of Onfray's book appears on the religious website Tothesource and you can read it here.
Reader Comments ( Page 4 of 110)
46. I just read some more comments and again, I enjoy reading the varying viewpoints...both the ones I agree with as well as the ones I don't. We're all entitled to our beliefs.
Nick, religion has been a tool used by men for centuries to stay in power and control money (as well as the masses). Look at the Crusades. Look at the Spanish Inquisitions. Look at our witch hunt history. It hasn't just evolved to this in the past 100 years. It goes back to the beginning of time.
Tarafly, I thought you made some very good points, although I don't get nasty with people who come up trying to push their religious viewpoints on me (Jehovah's Witnesses, Mormons, etc.), I do politely tell them that I already have my beliefs and would rather not have them try to push theirs on me but thanks anyway and have a great day...My time is too valuable to be subjected to someone trying to convince me that I'm wrong and they are right.
Knight of Baawa, I liked your comment about "How can a person hate that which doesn't exist?" That was a very logical question.
What usually scares me about religion and religious zealots is when there is no room for differences of opinion. I respect other people's rights to their opinions and beliefs as long as they don't infringe on mine or other's beliefs and opinions. One can BELIEVE that I'm going to Hell! I believe I've already been there thank you very much, got the Tee Shirt...never again!
Humane Human at 11:05AM on Aug 9th 2007
47. Rita,
If the bible is the only source of truth, why is it that bats aren't birds, hares don't chew cud, insects don't have four legs, the Earth isn't flat, there was no global flood, there was no mass enslavement of the jews in Egypt and consequently no Exodus?
You ask where do we come from--well where does god come from? You cannot special plead and say "god always was". That will not do. And no, do not lie to me and tell me that I'm depressed. I'm not. If you think I am, you must prove it, Rita. But you cannot.
There is no soul. There is no afterlife. There is no heaven. There is no hell. There is no god. There is no devil. Stop being a mewling little animal and raise yourself out of your primitive, atavistic beliefs, Rita. Stop believing in fairy tales.
Knight_of_BAAWA at 11:14AM on Aug 9th 2007
48. Andy, would you mind showing how Dawkins and Hitchens ignore what you say they do? Thanks.
Knight_of_BAAWA at 11:16AM on Aug 9th 2007
49. Many of the comments listed make a huge mistake in assuming that the Crusades and other religious wars concerning Christianity were the result of a belief in God. This is in fact is not true. Jesus Christ would never advocate such a view. The Crusades, for example, were only a gross distortion of Christian thought. In fact, one could successfully argue that that the Crusades were results of political motivations. Another problem with these many comments is that they assume morality is plausible apart from an absolute, moral law-giver (i.e. God). I would highly recommend reading C.S. Lewis's Mere Christianity, which makes it very apparent why Dawkins's moral system would never work apart from God. As a philosopher myself, I would agree that Nietzsche is at least a consistent atheist - without God there is no morality. Many atheists spout statements such as "Absolute morality doesn't exist" and then turn around and make statements such as "Belief in God is stupid, look at all the evil it has caused - wars, etc." Well, evil cannot exist without an absolute standard of good. And absolute morality is only possible with a law-giver.
Morina Martin at 11:31AM on Aug 9th 2007
50. Almost all my friends are atheists. They think the idea of God is silly and spend no time discussing it. They avoid the topic when possible, which isn't easy because theists will get in their faces. Now Atheists don't dig the way that I, as a Gnostic, speak my open contempt for the evil God, Saklas, that is worshipped by christians, muslims, and jews, and gives rise to theocracy, aristocracy and the third evil, toltalitarianism. Theists are the enemy of democracy.
Titus at 11:49AM on Aug 9th 2007
51. TaraFly I love what you had to say
One thing we all have in Common is we want to better the world
We believe our personal beliefs are best for everyone
The problem is some people think their beliefs are so superior that others lives are worthless.
When this happens religious and atheist kill each other.
Its not religion or atheism that causes the problem its just people thinking their views are the best
popshifty at 11:27AM on Aug 9th 2007
52. Andy,
Read "The New Inquisition" which points to the heresiologists as the source of toltalitarianist methodology. If their hadn't been for the church persecuting heretics, there wouldn't have been a Stalin.
Titus at 11:49AM on Aug 9th 2007
53. The real truth Dinesh is that like most religious fanatics you just hate atheists. Obviously in your case you are obsessed with it.
How sad that is...
David S. at 11:27AM on Aug 9th 2007
54. look around you idiots you think everything around us just happened. they all need to read the bible for a day or two. and i know the bible could have been rewritten, but so have all my recipies. if you want to hate someone, hate politicions. not someone you dont know. and if you hate god , then he must excist Duh
mike at 11:47AM on Aug 20th 2007
55. Just as a man can "backslide" from his religion, so it is possible for an entire "church" to do the same. Christians are capable of sin and evil just as any man.
America used to condone slavery. Does that mean America should be forever marked as oppressive or evil because of her failures in the past?
Satan is the present ruler of the Earth, and because of this, we can expect to see violence, corruption, and greed in EVERY institution of man until the return of the ONE Sinless Man, Jesus Christ.
Christ Himself said there will be many who say "LORD LORD!" And He will answer them with the words, "DEPART from ME you wicked and faithless servant, you NEVER knew me."
This applies to professed Christians, not Atheists!
You cannot claim that there is NO government because the leaders are corrupt, or because citizens don't obey its laws.
Neither can you claim that there is No God, based upon the Christian failures or their disobedience to the law of Love.
Jesus Christ WILL return as He must, because obviously we Christians will never get it quite right on our own. Christians aspire to goodness and peace and love, but there are forces at work within us and without that challenge, hinder, or even contradict our spiritual beliefs.
Jesus said that indeed there would be "believers" who did evil in God's sight who erroneously thought they were serving God by committing those evils.
The Inquisition was conducted by wolves in sheep's clothing. They used fear and violence to further their own power and influence in the Name of God, but God will address these matters.
What do we do as Americans in the Name of Liberty?
Do we say freedom is dead because of our past failures or our current ones? There IS a God, there is a Satan, and we all must contend with sin.
Denying these does not change anything.
Dane Graves at 11:32AM on Aug 9th 2007
56. I find it quite peculiar, unsetttling and dangerous that D'Souza's "defense of religion" is christened "Whats So Great About Christianity".
I love Christopher Hitchens, I don't necessarily agree with all his views on religion, but at least he has the courage to be a neoconservative that DOESN'T pander to the evangelical right.
azandi at 11:33AM on Aug 9th 2007
57. I find it difficult to continue reading when someone DECLARES their "truth" to be the ONLY truth (e.g., Rita saying "there is only one source of truth and that is in the Bible.") What about all the other religious groups feeling that THERE holy books are the "one source of truth." ALL these holy books were written by men (as in mankind). Because this is the case there is room for "misinterpretation" or in the case of Constantine, he out and out decided he didn't like some parts of the Bible from Christ's time and changed it to suit his Roman Catholic takeover of the church and state. The original language of Christ was Aramaic. Just as when any writer tries to rewrite from a language different from their own, such is the case of the Bible which underwent many reinterpretations. A good book to read on the subject is Rocco Errico's "Let There Be Light" and also his book "And There Was Light." He studied Aramaic and the culture and meanings of the people during those times and has a very inteligent grasp on the subject of Bible interpretations. Also, for those of you who don't seek information and just take your parents' and preachers word for things, you might want to look into Constantine. An easy to read site on the subject is this link: http://www.geocities.com/gadbyme/church.html
I'm not an Athiest because I do believe in a higher power than myself. However, I do feel the need to keep looking and questioning until I feel that I'm satisfied with the answers and I'm definitely still questioning which is why I read these kinds of articles and the replies to them.
Humane Human at 1:04PM on Aug 9th 2007
58. Mike: did god just happen?
Morina: Your No True Scotsman fallacy is tired and worn-out. And CS Lewish should have stuck to kiddie-fic, as his atrocious apologia is just one lie piled on top of another.
Knight_of_BAAWA at 11:33AM on Aug 9th 2007
59. Dane,
Saying there is a god, satan, and sin does not make them exist.
Knight_of_BAAWA at 11:34AM on Aug 9th 2007
60.
bob,
yes. "love God first, and then love your fellow mankind" jesus Christ
abe eapen at 11:36AM on Aug 9th 2007