Commentators like Alan Colmes put on a very constipated expression when they encounter the idea that America is a Christian nation. How else to explain Colmes' attempt to convince me that the founders were Deists? Actually I went on the Fox News Channel's Hannity & Colmes last night expecting to debate Christopher Hitchens. I was looking forward to informing Hitchens off the air that my book What's So Great About Christianity is outselling God Is Not Great even in the "Atheism" category on amazon.com. Alas, Hitchens was on a plane somewhere and didn't make it to the studio. So I had to make do with battling a much less adept opponent in Colmes.
The problem is that I don't think Colmes knows what a Diest is.
He seems to think that Deism is the eighteenth-century term for atheism. Deists, however, believe in a transcendent God who created the universe. In this sense Deists are by definition theists. Where Deists differ from Christians is that they believe that, having set the universe into motion, God goes on permanent vacation. The Deist God is akin to Aristotle's "first mover."
The vast majority of the American founders were not Deists but rather practicing Christians. As I pointed out on the show, even Benjamin Franklin could not be comfortably fitted into the Deist category. Franklin after all called for prayers to save the new country. Clearly he believed that God is solicitous of His Creatures and that prayers could be heard and answered. This isn't Deism.
Jefferson was the most irreverent of the founders, and he rejected the divinity of Christ and the miracles. Colmes seemed fascinated by Jefferson's habit of cutting out passages in the Bible he didn't approve of, a strategy that liberal judges seem to employ when dealing with the U.S. Constitution. Even Jefferson, though, gave as the source of our inalienable rights none other than the Creator. To translate for the benefit of atheists who have trouble understanding simple English: God is the source of all our rights. Not the Enlightenment. Not social contract theory. Not Voltaire's parlor ramblings. Startling though it may seem, America is based on "divine right," not the divine right of kings but a divine source of political authority extended from the one (the monarch) to the many (the people).
So America is not a Christian nation in that this country is not a theocracy, nor do Christians seek to make it one. America is, however, a Christian nation in that it was founded by Christians who recognized that its most fundamental principles derive exclusively from a transcendent source. Atheists may fret and fume over this, but that's the way it is.
Reader Comments ( Page 6 of 13)
76. @ Ken Berg...72
Don't be coy, Ken... there is another 'ken' commenting that non-Christians should be packing their bags because this is a Christian Nation...
... I asked him what was to be done about atheists if his fantasy were to be taken seriously... no reply as yet!
Perhaps he perceives atheists something like George Bush senior does... unpersons.
pboyfloyd at 4:10PM on Oct 31st 2007
77. pboy,
Before, Jesus decended into heaven (#3) he said, "I go to prepare a place for you and if I go I will surely, return," To me he has told me two very important things, #1. He is going home, being heaven, #2. Someday he is coming back for me. Sorry, he is in charge of time and space, not you and certainly not me. He, also is responsible for all of your fasinations with the planets. Besides, how do you know what would happen if what you say would take place? While we're at it, why does the world just hang out there in space spinning around and around on perfect timing? How do you explain the seasons, or the tide of the ocean? There so many questions about this earth and we do not have all the answers but, I know personally the one who does. Until, I meet him face to face I will continue to learn and study about the wonders he has performed in the past as well as the wonders to come. rita
Rita at 4:14PM on Oct 31st 2007
78. This is how much I believe in God. In the end; you and I will either be in Heaven ; or in Hell. Yes, I am a Christian. phflu.s.a.
peg haney at 4:14PM on Oct 31st 2007
79.
The statement that "America is a Christian nation."
Is NOT the same as the statement that "The majority of Americans are Christian."
The first is false; the second is true.
FL Chick at 4:22PM on Oct 31st 2007
80. Actually, Japan has an officially recognized religion and it is shinto, which is unique to Japan.
Will at 4:29PM on Oct 31st 2007
81. Josiejo:
"I don't know a heck of a lot of atheists. I do wonder, though, if they've ever in the greatest of sincerity, shouted or whispered to the heavens and said, "God, if you're real...then show me.""
Are you a Christian? As one, have you done the same thing towards the Gods of all other religions?
Tem at 4:32PM on Oct 31st 2007
82. Thank You Dinesh for speaking and writing so elequently in defense of our faith. Their anger in response to your argument reveals so much about them. Honest debate scares the hell of out them.
Keep it up!
michael at 4:33PM on Oct 31st 2007
83. @ Rita ..74
You say, "..While we're at it, why does the world just hang out there in space spinning around and around on perfect timing? How do you explain the seasons, or the tide of the ocean? There so many questions about this earth and we do not have all the answers..."
It was my understanding that humans made clocks which reflect the obeserved 'day', the tides are an effect of gravity(the gravity of the sun and the moon). The seasons are the effect of the inclination of the Earth, in our summer the North is inclined towards the Sun, in our spring and fall, the incline is tangential to (across) the orbit, equal day and night(equinox) and in our winter the Earth is inclined away from the Sun in our daytime.
The Earth does not just 'hang in space', it orbits the Sun, you know, once a year every year.
Hey, maybe you're right... maybe it's just magic.
pboyfloyd at 4:34PM on Oct 31st 2007
84. michael @79:
Dinesh uses this blog to attack atheists. It's not unreasonable for some of them to be angry. On a blog where the author bashes Christians, it would be reasonable to expect any Christians posting. Would you consider them scared?
Tem at 4:42PM on Oct 31st 2007
85. It's all beginning to make sense now as to why Dinesh is such a deluded moron. He's a religious nut just like Bush.
gshort3011 at 4:45PM on Oct 31st 2007
86. D and his followers are nothing but Jesus Pimps who along with the "Family Values 'Christian'" hypocirtes use God as a Wh.ore to further their own self-adoration, greed and lust for power over others....not unlike Ahmadinejad!
RobertMN at 4:46PM on Oct 31st 2007
87. pboy,
Again, you speak of human made objects to measure, move and change according to man's idea's, not God's. My question is to you before all of mankind's intelligence hit the scene it was all still there? Where did it come from? How was it placed in such a perfect rotation. Who put that sun out there to warm and the moon to give us light at night? What is your explaination of all of this where did it all come from. How is every cell in your body perfect in your DNA? If there is no GOD how did all of these things happen? How do explain it?
rita at 4:47PM on Oct 31st 2007
88. @post 81:
"any Christians posting"
I meant "angry Christians posting," but I think you get the point.
Tem at 4:46PM on Oct 31st 2007
89. Rita: Why does the question have to be "who" rather than "what"?
RobertMN at 4:54PM on Oct 31st 2007
90. Intelligent design in the universe is a deist issue, not a Christian issue. Oh, and if it's such perfect rotation why do we have 365.25 days a year and leap years? Why are we not at the center of the universe? The laws of physics have their own perfection, but our place in the universe has plenty of oddness to it.
Rita is like our big fluffy ball of glowing Jesus love. It's cute, but this is not the place for it. Some people can open their arms and embrace Christianity for being a bubble of love that makes them happy and gives them "answers". For many of the rest of us, we tread carefully to avoid accepting ideologies for irresponsible reasons.
Mokele Mbembe at 4:59PM on Oct 31st 2007