Teaching as a Form of Indoctrination

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Teaching as a Form of Indoctrination

Posted Dec 13th 2007 7:23AM by Dinesh D'Souza
Filed under: Islam, Christianity, Controversy, Atheism

Philosopher Daniel Dennett wants to force all parents, even parents who home-school their offspring, to give up their children to educators like himself. For what purpose? To expose the children, Dennett argues, to "uncontroversial" facts about the world's religions. Listen to Dennett make his case in a short segment from our recent debate in Boston, and then you can hear my answer to him.

In his book on religion, Dennett writes, "How much do we regard children as being the property of their parents? It's one thing to say people should be free to believe whatever they like, but should they be free to impose their beliefs on their children? Is there something to be said for society stepping in?" Dennett insists that "parents don't literally own their children the way slaveowners once owned slaves, but are, rather, their stewards and guardians, and ought to be held accountable by outsiders for their guardianship, which does imply that outsiders have a right to interfere."

During our debate, Dennett asked me what part of his proposal I disagreed with. Well, I agree with him that one of the purposes of education is to expose young people to facts and ideas that they do not get at home. But I disagree with Dennett's presumption that parents are typically the indoctrinators while educators are always the liberators. Notice how derisively and condescendingly he talks about religion. His derision is entirely unsubstantiated by facts. He mocks the Vatican and wonders if it will one day become a museum, and he wonders if Mecca is headed for repossession as "Disney's Magic Kingdom of Allah." Sure enough, a good part of the audience is moved to snickers and laughter. This is bigotry posing as intellectual sophistication. Dennett has taught the undergraduates well: chuckle at anyone who takes religion seriously and this is how you will be considered an enlightened, mature person.

We should turn Dennett's questions on him and apply them to professors: "How much do we regard children as being the property of their teachers? Should secular educators be free to impose their anti-religious beliefs on young people? Is there something to be said for society stepping in? Universities don't literally own undergraduates the way slaveowners once owned slaves but are, rather, their stewards and guardians and ought to be held accountable by outsiders for their guardianship, which does imply that outsiders have a right to interfere."

For legislators, alumni and parents, probably the best way to hold universities accountable is through financial leverage. The way I do it is to take on self-satisfied pedants like Dennett and expose them, in front of their own students, as intellectual emperors without clothes. Watch the Dennett debate and you will see how the snickers and applause of the skeptics eventually gives way to a sullen silence. These students are desperately in need of an alternative to the strident secularism of Dennett and his colleagues. True liberation for young people means freedom not only from the ignorant fundamentalism that Dennett rails about, but also freedom from the secular fundamentalism that he and many others in the academy sadly embody.

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Reader Comments ( Page 2 of 35)

Previous 15 Comments | 1 | 2 | 3 | 4 | 5 | Most Recent | Next 15 Comments

16. dd wrote: This is bigotry posing as intellectual sophistication

YES, dd, you're right. THIS, as in your blog, is indeed bigotry posing as intellectual sophistication....EVERY DAY.

I do see the falsehoods you write, and now, seeing how you attribute your own tactics and sin to others' actions, it makes me think you are the devil.

Oh, and why not laugh at the vatican? There is a nazi sitting on their throne at the moment.

a good christian at 10:53AM on Dec 13th 2007

17. pd, what about my rights as an atheist parent? What you are really saying is that no one has the right to trump the rights of CHRISTIAN parents! Little narrow-minded, don't you think? I pay my dues to this country just like you do. And where are you getting that atheists don't teach fundamental science? Just another unfounded accusation to falsely establish your superiority?

emma at 10:56AM on Dec 13th 2007

18. pd: and you missed my point too.

Nowhere did I say that anything should 'trump' parents' rights. GAWD FORBID. I was pointing out the reality of what happens to young children when they are indoctrinated.

It was more of a plea to parents to respect their children's free will.

Linda at 10:55AM on Dec 13th 2007

19. Dinesh, could you please stop humiliating Dennett!!
If you are so smart and courageous, next time pick a fight with a guy who can defend himself. To beat mediocre people is no demonstration of bravery!! You should know that.

Felipe Miguel at 10:59AM on Dec 13th 2007

20. ATHEIST

Once in a while, you try to answer a question, and you come up with a Great Truth. Other times, you only answer the specific question that you were asked.

TODAY'S BLOG: In his book on religion, Dennett writes, "How much do we regard children as being the property of their parents? It's one thing to say people should be free to believe whatever they like, but should they be free to impose their beliefs on their children? (end)

Impose beliefs on children? Well, let's put this in context. Yesterday, we were talking about a Muslim man in Ontario who beat his daughter to death because she resisted when he tried to impose HIS religious and or cultural beliefs (it was a scarf worn over the head) on her.

Dennett gave a GREAT answer to a specific question. Taken out of context... well, heck, Dinesh wouldn't be a PHONY scholar if he didn't misquote and take statements out of context.

Reply to: this body cannot inherit the world to come because of sin. jesus rose from the dead because he was the first in every order. paul even said if jesus was not raised we as believers are most miserable and our hope is in vain. if he did not rise we are still lost and we should all be atheist because it would not matter brian (end)

Brian, you serve as an excellent example of the toxic Christianity that sent Matthew Murray into a suicidal depression.

IMAGINE if you will...

growing up in a family where your mother, your father, your younger brother and your uncle...

are all as determined to MAKE YOU SEE THE LIGHT as brian and rita are.

In this family, the father isn't above turning you over his knee and spanking you... IF you don't show the proper respect for HIS beliefs about Jesus and how our souls are going to survive these temporary physical bodies.

And how Satan made a pact with Amy Grant so she would leave her husband and marry Vince Gill.. (seriously, that was part of Matthew Murray's posting.)

brian, you've got to learn to let go.

Otherwise, someday your children will turn out like Matthew Murray. Driven into a homicidal and suicidal rage because they can't make you stop the nonsense.

William Hays at 11:15AM on Dec 13th 2007

21. pd, it would make sense that you would rant about intolerance of linda and not look at the intolerance of christians and members of other religions.

what's the matter? afraid that if schools teach the facts about all other religions some kids might start looking more into them and decide something other than christianity better suits their beliefs?

at the very least it may help them to better understand the people of other religions and improve religious tolerance (uh oh, there's that word again).

Richelle at 11:17AM on Dec 13th 2007

22. "This is bigotry posing as intellectual sophistication."

I like this, it should be the title of this blog!

Snarky commentary aside:

As other posters have mentioned, the primary issue is that parents have much more control over what is learned at the developmental level of their children. As a child's primary authority figure a parent needs to be trustworthy and believable.

Attending a university is a choice. Although it is completely understandable that we would want professors to be seen as an authority on their subject matter, universities are also intended to foster critical thinking. As such, we should be able to question their thinking. This is how we all learn.

Now, had DD used public schools rather than universities as the target of his attack, then he might have a case, as the attendees are much more malleable. But the Christians already know this, which is why push so hard in trying to get their indoctrinational information included in the public curriculum.

Cognaw at 11:24AM on Dec 13th 2007

23. Of course, Richelle, if major religions were taught to kids, atheism would have to be taught also as a 'belief'

That may be the crux of the whole thing. Imagine kids being taught that no belief is OK.

Linda at 11:25AM on Dec 13th 2007

24. Dinesh,

The question is not whether we should indoctrinate our children with religion or atheism....it should be what is the best for our children? In other industrialized nations across the earth there is never a discussion of education being faith based, whether in Tokyo, Sweden, Norway, iceland, England, or France. And all of these countries have a higher ranking than the USA in education standards as well as persons with higher education in the sciences and technology fields.

The United States is being left behind when it comes to education....there is no doubt about this...all statistics and research point that the United states is being "dumbed down" because science has been continuously watered down and reduced in importance in our public schools. Organized religion, mainly Evangelical christianity, under the guise of the "Wedge" movement is trying to subvert not just Darwins' Theory of Natural Selection, but the entire scientific methodology. We are the laughing stock of the world...as we substitute proven testable and quanitfiable science in our curriculae with preacher babble and supernatural idealogy. Read the transcripts of the recent trial against the Dover School board......it's a very large subversive effort to bring "creationism" back into the education system by rebranding it "Intelligent Design". Good gosh people...think about it....this term didn't even exist 10 years ago!

So if you think you are doing your child a favor by indoctrinating them in pseudo science and the blatant fantasy stories in the Bible....instead of giving them a firm grounding in the real world of Stocks, Ipods, design of sub microscopic computer chips, nanotechnology, Helicopter Flight paths and vector diagramming, think again. You are contributing to the "dumbing down" of the United States of America.

Larry D. Davis at 11:27AM on Dec 13th 2007

25. In the end it is the PARENTS' role to decide with what values their children should be brought up under. Education can teach whatever is true or theory, but must stay away from controverting that which is a parent's right to teach. School can say that evolution is still a theory, but you have to learn the theory to pass midterms. Then we won't have to deal with critics who don't even understand what they're talking about (e.g. "If we evolved from apes why are there still apes?").

Mokele-Mbembe at 11:29AM on Dec 13th 2007

26. if i could only copy and paster the snide drivil being leveled at a sensible man making a valid argument. DD once more tackles and slays one of the stalworth bastions of atheism. leaving the faithful to grovel at names and mean spirited comments. its all you guys can do. it is indeed proof you have utter disdain and hatred for the mans freedom to express himself. all you do is redicule, deride and chide, its so funny. thats why i said in the last post that your DD toys, predictable as a puppet on a string. why not not comment. have zeros for numbers of post and see what would happen. DD's right but why take his bait?

brian at 11:32AM on Dec 13th 2007

27. What, pray tell, is DD's great alternative to secularism?

Mokele-Mbembe at 11:36AM on Dec 13th 2007

28. Not that I talk to brian little b but

when is he going to learn to spell DRIVEL?

stalworth?

For a while, I thought he was a 'plant' to make us think christians are, well, slow.

Linda at 11:36AM on Dec 13th 2007

29. brian, you are just simply not as good a christian man as me and my buddy dinesh. That is so obvious.

a good christian at 11:40AM on Dec 13th 2007

30. Donte Stallworth?

a good christian at 11:40AM on Dec 13th 2007

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Mo Rocca appears on a bunch of shows, including CBS News Sunday Morning (with the indescribably wonderful Charles Osgood), The Tonight Show on NBC, and NPR's Wait Wait... Don't Tell Me! He's a sometime judge on Iron Chef and was featured on Telemundo's Amore Descarado. Last year he starred on Broadway in the 25th Annual Putnam County Spelling Bee. His expose "All the President's Pets" was published by Crown in 2004.