The Lakota Indians, descendants of Crazy Horse and and Sitting Bull, have officially withdrawn from the treaties they had with the United States, the AFP is reporting, meaning they have declared themselves a new nation formally separate from America. The article quotes Indian rights activist Russell Means as saying: "We are no longer citizens of the United States of America and all those who live in the five-state area [Nebraska, South Dakota, North Dakota, Montana and Wyoming] that encompasses our country are free to join us."
It also points out that the new Lakota country plans to issue its own passports, driving licenses and tax plan (that is, there will be no taxes). We went to the Lakota Freedom Delegation to find out more about their plans, but the site appears to have been downed by too much traffic. Here's the link if you want to try it.
How will this new nation survive? Well, their one advantage is they have almost nothing left to lose: The Lakota's men have a frighteningly short lifespan: forty-four years. Teen suicide, infant mortality and unemployment are all very high.
And on one hand, they certainly have every right to want nothing more to do with the U.S. (Wonkette has some details about recent mistreatment). On the other, it doesn't seem likely this is all going to go smoothly . Somehow we think the U.S. might have a little something to say about this secession plan, especially given the fact that the Indians are inviting regular old Americans to renounce U.S. citizenship and live in their community tax-free.
Reader Comments ( Page 3 of 4)
31. First off, the whole idea about reservations is completely out of date. Its ridiculous, by that logic, we should have mexican reservations also. we CONQUERED the indians! we took the spoils of war. you didn't see us start up reservations on guam, hawaii, and other lands we have takin over. Also, the complaints about them living in bad conditions are completely out of line. All the reservations are constantly complaining about how they want their own land to control. well you can't be your own nation, refuse to cooperate with local authorities, and demand reservations and still expect to receive help from the United States. you are either with us, which means you live like the rest of us, not on your own reservations. or you are your own sovereign nation in which there should be no reason why we have to take care of you. Plus, the idea of them splitting off of the United State is just plain stupid. if they want their own nation fine, but then there is no reason why we can't simply take over their "country" and no reservations this time. And even if some how they manage to find some loop hole keeping us from invading. then i guess we will just have to secure our borders, they won't have any chance of trade to the outside world. they will pretty much be locking themselves in an oversized prison. WORKS FOR ME!!!
bob jones at 3:24AM on Dec 21st 2007
32. Fully supporting the Lakota's!
Although I've only very little native american in my blood, I fully believe it's their right, as any State's right to secede if the majority agree's... isn't that what democracy is supposed to be about?
I mean heck, even the former Soviet Union allowed it to happen, can America be thought of as more evil, restrictive and controlling than the "Evil Empire?"... nuff said, read between the lines.
jon20013 at 3:52AM on Dec 21st 2007
33. maybe usa have now there own kosovo or chechnya. but that they had it 100-200 years ago ...
paul at 6:11AM on Dec 21st 2007
34. The Spanish screwed them first, then came us, whites, then came everyone else. This land belonged to the natives in the first place. What gripe me is, How could Europens come to a land and claim it. How would we feel if Russia for example landed on our shores and claimed this land. As for as I'm concerned, Indians still own this country, we just live here and in any case, they couldn't screw it any worse than we have. We whited throw money at every so called "minorty" in the world in the form of "welfare" but we screw the one race who should mean the most to us. I wish this and all the tribes the very best of luck although, we all know the government will not let them secede. If I were free to do so, I would be standing with the Lakotas all the way.
Jack at 12:26PM on Dec 21st 2007
35. I'm just curious about the reactions of the Cheyenne, Black Foot, Crow, Araphoe, and Shoshoni peoples to this. That 5 state area includes these, and a number of other indigenous groups that may have a claim on parts of that country. Sounds a little chaotic. I'm certainly glad that Means is mostly promoting himself.....
Greg at 3:42PM on Dec 21st 2007
36. Hey Brad, it's LaKota - you can at least spell it correctly...I am happy for their nation. It is long overdue. If anyone has been to a reservation, one can easily see how Americans have oppressed these people and taken over - their stores are not even run by native americans. We have turned our back on them and disgraced them and they have every cause to secede. Try going to a Pow Wow next time one is around and see what their culture is REALLY about. The native americans I have met are some of the most spiritual I have ever known and their belief in the Creator is beautiful...we have a lot to learn from the indiginous people of our nation.
Vicki at 2:29PM on Dec 21st 2007
37. Good for the Lakota. The USA was created on the backs of Indigenous people.
Delvin at 10:49AM on Dec 21st 2007
38. Did the Lakota people vote for this? Did the tribal council vote for this? Or did Russell Means grant himself the authority to decide for all Lakota?
Who Voted at 10:01AM on Dec 21st 2007
39. The Native Americans did not GIVE us this country, we took it. That's history - the more powerful come into an area they want and take it (by force, if necessary). If they were stronger, they would have driven us out. The European immigrants built this country, so NO - it does not belong to the Native Americans simply because they immigrated here first.
Kiddo78 at 12:05PM on Dec 21st 2007
40. I'd like to respond to Hannabanna
What everyone fails to notice is: if those freakin indians didn't like the way they were being treated, they had every right to leave and be normal US citizens.
Are you Serious? If I reverse the situation (think hard) and took away everything you have, would you then want to join me and be normal? I am talking about talking away the language you speak with, the religion you celebrate, the land you live on, the government you built and the children you bore, and now I'm standing on what used to be yours telling you that everything you have been for the last thousand years and have believed in for all time are worthless and I wonder why you are not jumping at the chance to be more like me. Check your perspective before you make judgement.
The only reason why this group of people were so deeply impoverished is because they wasted all the (US) government assistance they received on booze
I am going to assume that you do not have an itemized account of the spending habits of every individual that makes up the First Nations we are talking about, so what supports this statement? Have you taken into consideration the facts that no one seems willing to employ First Nations people, or that, being stuck out on reservations or in low income housing means that good paying jobs are too far away to be sustained?
and on starting up those infamous indian casinos.
Please explain what the issue is of creating an income source where you live that employs your people and takes advantage of a person's right to choose. First Nations are not clubbing people over the head and dragging them into their establishments. America is about choice right?
If they had actually gotten off their fat red butts they could have become prosperous;
Hang on. Now it seems that you are angry that they didn't become prosperous fast enough, but in the sentence before you are upset because they have make attempts to become prosperous. Or are you upset that they have butts?
however, they were just waiting for the benefits of what their ancestors lost (150 years ago!) to fall into their laps. If they had taken any initiative whatsoever, then they would have had a better life.
Let's play that pretend game again. Pretend I take everything from you, like I did above, but this time I make a promise, like a treaty or something, that says things like,we're going to stop killing you if you stop trying to kill us and here is some land to live on right now, we'll pay you for everything we took from you and if we need anything from off or under your land we'll pay you for that too. We'll get you settled away where we won't bother with you, I mean bother you and then we'll set up some payments. Now imagine that everytime you come to my door, and you have to come to my door because I don't come to yours now that I have all your stuff, I say something like, 'Oh ya. I did promise to pay didn't I. I'll cut you a check tomorrow. Promise. Oh, and here's a couple of bucks to tide you over till the check arrives.' Now you, being of good faith and assuming I am as well, go home and wait for this check. When it doesn't arrive you come back to my door and we repeat the exchange. Continue to imagine that this goes on for, say, 150 years or so. At what point were you suppose to forget everything that was owed to you and start from scratch trying to remake what you lost?
You can't reap rewards without putting hard work into them.
Sure you can! You find a continent that has a population that you can fairly easily destroy, through genocide, enculturation, assimulation, and demoralization and then you take everything that they had for yourself. Rewards without anyhard work and you get to feel superior.
Furthermore, if the indians were really serious about their "independence," then how are they going to provide for all their people? If they can't make it with the US government's assistance,
Let's see what the government assistance got them so far. No land. No sense of self. Loss of religion. Loss of Language and art. Destruction of a way of life. Constant reminders through white celebrations like Columbus Day/ Thanksgiving that their history of genocide and unjust conflicts against them are buried under turkey fat, store sales and sports mascots in costumes fashioned after their religious artifacts jumping around in characterizations of what white thinks First Nations are like. Destruction of their governments and controlling bodies. No prospect of work or better living conditions. An outside population that is openly hostile to them because this outside population has no real knowledge of them. So with all this previous assistance, how much assistance would be appropriate now? Any thoughts? How much, exactly, does each individual from a First Nations community recieve in assistance? Get back to me when you have some hard numbers.
then how the heck are they going to make it on their own?
They were fine on their own before Europeans came. Give them back everything that was taken and see how badly off they are.
How are they going to provide medical treatments (from the knowledge given them by the US, I might add)
You seem to be saying that First Nations cannot think or learn. Are you saying only white america can possess medical knowledge? Can you stitch up a gash, or perform open heart surgery, or operate radiation equipment to destroy cancer cells? If you cannot then you must not be american enough. Knowledge is not something you can lord over someone. Assuming that someone is lesser than you and therefore cannot possess knowledge simple proves how uneducated you really are.
if they have no source of revenue on the land? How are they going to afford millions of dollars worth of equipment, not to mention the pay of medical workers?
No source of revenue? What about those casinos? Why not tax havens like the Swiss banks? Why not attach the hospitals directly to the Casinos so that when the overweight americans have a heart attack because they've lost their house, land and pay check (way of life) to the First Nations because of a bad decision, they can be cared for somewhere safely away from the profit generating populous. I rather like the idea of land that was originally bought for a handfull of shiny beads being bought back for some flashing casino lights or the outcome of some flashy card game. It's like modern irony.
Or rather, are they going to revert back to their traditional healings-- yes, let's cover that gash on your arm with mud, that'll heal you...
See now, this is just name calling again. You're making yourself feel more powerful by degrading someone else by perpetuating the belief the people of First Nations know less than you. This is how bullies function. I'm going to tell other people something that I don't like about you long enough that they start to believe me and think it is bad too. All that is missing is 'Nah na na nah na!'
Are you a medical practitioner? Do you know what heals and what doesn't? Are you basing your knowledge on something you saw in a Hollywood Western or television drama? For a person that wishes the First Nations would die off, you sure are preoccupied with their health.
As enticing an offer as THAT sounds, any half witted person would run in the opposite direction from these crazy indian folks.
Again with the name calling. 'Crazy Indian folks', 'half-witted'. What if everyone in the First Nations was suffering Post Tramatic Stress disorder, brought on by 200 years of destruction of their way of life? While crazy is not a physc definition, I'd allow it. And what about wanted what is rightfully theirs makes them crazy? If you took away everything that makes me me, I'd go crazy.
As far as being half witted,
making a decision, opinion or judgement without digging for and considering all factors surrounding a situation, one can have less than half the knowledge to decide correctly. This would mean they have half their wits yes? So, did you have all, or any facts to support the opinions you expressed above? Which direction were you running in again?
Long story short, I think it's good that these Indians will finally stop leaching off our government.
Stop the train here. In your first paragraph you wanted 'these indians' to become 'normal americans'.
Now you are saying that it's your government, not theirs. As far as the leaching goes, if this is their land that america has tried to take illegally from them, wouldn't all the 'normal americans' be the ones leaching?
I am tired of my taxes going to pay for their whiskey.
Compared to what the country really owes the First Nations, I'd have thought you'd prefer this bargin price of whiskey for an entire way of life.
Your words are those of a bully, from a nation of bullies. Might makes right, strong survive, Power is....Blah blah blah. The thing to remember about bullying is that eventually somebody will pop the bully in the snout and take back the power the bully has taken from them. Your closing statement might be considered prophetic for bullies in the future. "In the end, they will meet their demise, to which I will say, "good riddance.""
How's your nose?
scott at 12:56PM on Dec 21st 2007
41. More than independence, these Lakota and all other Indians need economic self-reliance. The Lakota nation is located in the poorest area in the country in southern South Dakota. It would be a nice show of solidarity if the Navajo Nation seceded too. I think all Americans need to stand by these people who the civil rights movement completely ignored. Gays, blacks, women haven't had to take nearly as much shit as our indigenous peoples.
This paleface is rooting for you guys.
AndrewV at 10:49AM on Dec 21st 2007
42. Well said, Scott.
If I could afford it, I too would be there to join them.
More power to you Lakotah's. Go all the way...
Lori at 8:57PM on Dec 21st 2007
43. Scott – What can you expect with a name like hannabanana? Thank you for responding to her tirade of which she so clearly knows nothing about. Also thank you to Justin Case for his condensed addition of the Native history. Hanna’s arrogance is by far to prevalent in today’s society and her ignorance is obvious in her choice of word. What a hateful triad and what a waste of a mind. If I had to guess I would guess hanna lives in South Dakota.
Hanna if you try to be more articulate your argument would perhaps not be marginalized.
Gwen at 11:19AM on Dec 21st 2007
44. There are some very naive commments being made for both sides of this argument. The bottom line is that there is no "perfect" society. Ours (US) is about the closest there is. We are free to go and do as we wish (within the law). In about 95% of the countries around the world half the posters on this forum would have already been arrested - or worse. No one has taken the Native American's right to worhip any God they choose or stay in touch with their heritage; in fact in most areas these practices are encouraged. Many Native Am. have been GIVEN free houses and LAND in states such as Oklahoma and Arizona. The Native American people that wanted to leave the reservation and become a part of the maintsream society are free to do so, however, many wish to stay and live off of the benefits they get on the reservation. I applaud the Native Am. that have and continue to be a positive influence on their and mainstream US society. Finally, as some posters have stated, the lands where some of the reservations are located are far from any cities and industry. Therefore, what makes anyone supporting this move believe things will get better because the LaKota are their own nation? The land is still going to be rural farm and ranch land. There will be NO source of revenue other than what this land can provide. If the inhabitants of the land are not prospering by using it to it's advantage now, what will change later?
Really folks, some of the America bashing has to stop. We are not killing "millions" around the world. More accurately -- we are helping prevent the killing of "millions" around the world. Without our intervention in world affairs - there would STILL be war in the balkans (remember Yugoslavia), Hussain would still be killing his own people to further his wealth, the Taliban would still be a major player in drug production and trafficing(and living lavishly while the rest of the country starved), and etc. etc. Greg
Greg at 11:37AM on Dec 21st 2007
45. Greg
America did take away the rights of the Native Americans to worship as they pleased. They in essence outlawed their religion. They took there children. The children where not allowed to speak their native language and were often harshly punished when they tried. They were the displaced again and again until they were allotted the least desirable land in the country. However long ago this was, it has affected Native American Culture for generations. American politicians stripped them of their religion, their children, their rescores, and their culture. Furthermore the benefits of living on the Res are minimal. I know many Americans like to think all Natives are rich from Casinos, but the truth is many reservations do not allow casinos on their land. Example – the largest res in North America, the Navajo Res prohibits booze, gambling, and porn. If you believe track housing is so great because it is free then perhaps you should try living in one. Many of these free houses are not even equipped with running water. Also a track house is a small token to receiver for the allotments land intended for farming many received in the 50-60’s that were again taken back.
Why do the not move off the res? Not for the minimal benefits they receive, they do not move off the res for the same reason I do not leave Michigan even though the economy sucks – it’s their home. I was raised as were my people before me. I love Michigan lakes and trees and could not imagine living anywhere else. This is my home. Please do not stereotype what you don’t know.
Gwen at 12:00PM on Dec 21st 2007