Last night in Orange County I had one of my liveliest debates with atheist Christopher Hitchens and the Jewish radio host Dennis Prager. The debate--a sort of Christian-Atheist-Jew slugfest--was held at the Bat Yahm synagogue in Newport Beach. There was a sellout crowd of 1,500, with about 400 turned away.
The debate was unusual in that it involved not two but three different perspectives. Hitchens was particularly harsh in his exchanges with Prager, at one point accusing Prager of covering up for anti-Semitism. My exchanges with Hitchens were consistently sharp but also mutually respectful, and later Hitchens told me that I am one of the most formidable debaters that he has ever faced. I predict this debate will generate huge interest when it is posted on the web. After the debate Hitchens joined my wife and me at the bar where we downed two bottles of Pinot Noir and solved many of the world's problems.
Since our debate focused on God as understood from a Christian, Jewish and atheist perspective, missing from the event was a Muslim perspective. This is a pity, because one staple item of atheist rhetoric is the equation of Islamic extremism with Christianity. In my cross-examination I pressed Hitchens on this issue, and will let viewers watch our exchange for themselves and make up their own minds.
We find the equation between "Islamic fundamentalism" and "Christian fundamentalism" not only among the new atheists but also in the popular culture. Several weeks ago Christiane Amanpour of CNN did her special on "God's Warriors." The premise: The Abrahamic religions all lead to extremism. So Amanpour did three segments, one on Islamic extremism, one on Jewish extremism and one on Christian extremism.
Striking to the viewer, however, was the strained attempt to equate the three. Islamic extremism featured the 9/11 attacks, the Bali bombing, the London bombing, the Madrid bombing, and the list goes on. What about Christian extremism? Well, there was Christiane Amanpour in desperate search for the Christian Bin Laden, the Christian Al Qaeda, the Christian Hamas, the Christian Hezbollah, the Christian state currently run along the lines of post-Khomeini Iran.
Poor Christiane came up empty handed. So she was forced to locate marginal groups which would be repudiated by 99.9 percent of Christians and try to pass them off as the Christian equivalent of the Islamic radicals. I was especially interested to find out that there is an old guy in the hills of Montana who wants to blow up the world in the name of Jesus. Too bad he's broke and doesn't have any teeth. Still, one day he hopes to get a job and carry out his nefarious plans. I suppose this is the closest thing to a Christian Bin Laden. We are all supposed to be very afraid of this man!
One of the new atheists very cleverly termed 9/11 a "faith based initiative." But the witticism conceals an intellectual sleight-of-hand. Bush merely wants the government to be able to support faith-based charities on the same basis as it supports secular charities. What happened at the World Trade Center and the Pentagon seven years ago can hardly be placed in the same intellectual category.
Of late some of the new atheists are backing off from their fraudulent analogy between Islamic extremism and Christianity. This is a powerful blow to the new atheism, because so much of its relevance came from its ability to surf on the wave of current events and interpret modern terrorism as the expression of a generic religious impulse. In reality Bin Laden is more accurately compared to an atheist despot like Pol Pot. I realize the analogy is not entirely fair--to Bin Laden! After all, Bin Laden's death toll (several thousand killed over a dozen years) doesn't come closer to Pol Pot's 2 million killed in the space of three years.
Besides, Pol Pot was a Little League atheist compared to Mao and Stalin, whose death toll was in the tens of millions. When it comes to mass murder in the modern era, Islamic radicalism simply cannot keep up with atheism.
Reader Comments ( Page 6 of 54)
76. In truth, the mere fact that religion is still around, proves that, as a species with such large potention, we're still in our infancy.
Godless Heathen Brian at 8:37PM on May 2nd 2008
77. GHB - in short the protestants came about because the tradition of men was not to the glory of God. A falling away from the teachings of the Bible. Martin Luther posted these issues not to break away, but that they could be addressed, and draw closer to God in Spirit. However as we know, it became a great divide.
Man_in_Wilderness at 8:37PM on May 2nd 2008
78. MIW, unless you invent my Christ-O-Meter, we non-believers still will use the standard definition, if you don't mind. Since you guys all have your "ultimate authority" and are sure you're the real ones, and can't even agree amongst yourselves what a real christian is, then it negates the validity of your version. A christian is simeone that believes they are a christian, since it's all about belief here.
Godless Heathen Brian at 8:40PM on May 2nd 2008
79. 75. GHB - in short the protestants came about because the tradition of men was not to the glory of God. A falling away from the teachings of the Bible. Martin Luther posted these issues not to break away, but that they could be addressed, and draw closer to God in Spirit. However as we know, it became a great divide.
Man_in_Wilderness at 8:37PM on May 2nd 2008
------------------------
No, the corruption was always there. These are the people that WROTE and COMPILED the bible, and their heirs. The corruption was put there by constantine. Try for just a moment thinking as if it were, and look at the evidence to prove THAT, instead of automatically taking the christian point of view here. If you do that in this scenario, surely you can see that you won't see it? Since what I'm saying here is that the christian mindset was carefully DESIGNED. There's yout intelligent design. Intelligent, shrwed, calculating, and pure evil. Don't be blind to it. I used to be, and woke up. It's a better live without the lie.
Godless Heathen Brian at 8:47PM on May 2nd 2008
80. Does Dinesh ever post anything other than blatant lies?
Knight_of_BAAWA at 9:01PM on May 2nd 2008
81.
Ok, I have a really important question, a poll actually. Stay in, or go out?
Now, my friend that's a flight attendant for American is in town tonight, a group of us were going to go out tonight, but we are going to hang out tomorrow too. Also, I just got back from an amazing massage, and I'm so relaxed, all I want to do is curl up on the couch and watch a movie. Would I be a heel if I stand them up tonight, but go hang with them tomorrow? Am I being selfish?
Please say no.
tay at 9:03PM on May 2nd 2008
82. What's the movie Tay?
JefFlyingV at 9:09PM on May 2nd 2008
83.
I don't know yet, any suggestions?
tay at 9:14PM on May 2nd 2008
84. Which would give you more joy, staying in or going out? I wouldn't suggest a movie, due to my old man tastes, I like pre 1980's movies which include black and white going back to the 30's.
JefFlyingV at 9:23PM on May 2nd 2008
85. Thanks for the hugs...really great...and the support...although people donate to large agencys to try and help people...much of the money goes to pay the the ex. ceo and admininstration costs....very little goes to actually help the people...want to talk terror....people in the "dounut hole" will are having a hard time even finding the correct meds they need in the underground...people that are caught helping these desparte people are considered drug dealers...so the nurses and doctors can't even disperse emerancy meds....This is terror...in our own country....Thanks Antonio you kindness is appreciated.....
I'm looking forward to tomorrow and reading all of your words...and Thanks for including me... Hugs to all...goodnight
Pati at 9:29PM on May 2nd 2008
86.
More joy? Tonight?
Staying in, but I feel guilty for not going out.
tay at 9:28PM on May 2nd 2008
87. If these are great friends, go out with them.
JefFlyingV at 9:36PM on May 2nd 2008
88.
All of the other people going,(besides the friend from out of town) are friends that I see all of the time, and with them, things always get a little wild, and I'm not really in the mood for that tonight. My flight attendant friend is the only one I'm worried about stiffing, but we are going to go shopping and to lunch tomorrow, which I will enjoy much more.
tay at 9:42PM on May 2nd 2008
89. Then stay in and enjoy a movie, and go shopping tomorrow.
JefFlyingV at 9:47PM on May 2nd 2008
90.
I know, I think I just needed some reassurance, because I am still sitting here with my hair up, wearing the sweats and zip up hoody that I wore to the salon for my massage.
If I was going to go out, I wasn't making much progress.
:)
tay at 9:52PM on May 2nd 2008