What is the source of that liberty, equality and fraternity that are now the guiding principles of the West, if not the modern world?
Historians note the anomaly that these principles originated and developed only in Western civilization. In this sense, they are not universal. Of late, however, these principles are being exported to the rest of the world. One may say they are Western in origin but universal in their application.
But where do the principles come from? With the death of Heidegger and Sartre, Jurgen Habermas is now regarded as perhaps our leading living philosopher. Habermas is also an atheist. Yet when Habermas found out that the European Union in its charter gave full acknowledgement to ancient Greece and Rome, but none to Christianity, he erupted in learned outrage.
Habermas's argument is that it is philosophically illiterate to locate the roots of the West in Athens but not in Jerusalem. In fact, Habermas argues that Jerusalem--by which he means Judaism and Christianity--is far more responsible than Athens for the modern principles of liberty, equality and fraternity. In "A Time of Transition," Habermas writes:
For the normative self-understanding of modernity, Christianity has functioned as more than just a precursor or catalyst. Universalistic egalitarianism, from which sprang the ideals of freedom and a collective life in solidarity, the autonomous conduct of life and emancipation, the individual morality of conscience, human rights and democracy, is the direct legacy of the Judaic ethic of justice and the Christian ethic of love.
Habermas's point is that there is too much arrogance in contemporary atheism. Even the atheist is standing on mountain erected by Christianity. How ungrateful it is to scorn the mountain that is still holding you up! How ridiculous the posture of the man who cannot acknowledge the very foundation that sustains him from below!
This is what Christians mean when they say that America is a Christian society. This is not a call for theocracy or "rule of the priests" but rather a call for a public acknowledgement of the historic role of Christianity in shaping our institutions, our values and our culture. The opinions of several leading Supreme Court justices on church-and-state issues would benefit greatly from a slight familiarity with the history that Habermas is talking about.
Habermas's argument would have struck a chord with the greatest atheist of modern times, the philosopher Nietzsche. Nietzsche argued that if you want to get rid of the Christian God, at least have the honesty and the guts to repudiate the Christian ideals of human dignity, human equality and human liberty.
Yet our village atheists want to have it both ways. They want to reject God but preserve at least certain core aspects of the Christian legacy. Nietzsche would have had nothing but scorn for these little men of unbelief, Lilliputians hurling their tiny javelins at the Christian God while they continue to live off His inheritance.
Reader Comments ( Page 2 of 29)
16. tmo at #10:
Your question is answered in The Everlasting Man. Read more if you want to stop showing the ignorant you are.
Reepicheep at 7:47AM on Aug 7th 2008
17. Just in ... another MAJOR scientist now RENOUNCES his ATHEISM. Check it out On the Right-hand side panel under "In The News" section of the site below: He now declares that he has discovered God!
http://www.evolutionfacts.blogspot.com
Word.
WILL SMITH at 8:02AM on Aug 7th 2008
18. Dinesh.
I really love the commentors you attract on your blog.
They really should learn from actual rational atheists (usually french) that hedonistic materialism is your only real option.
Secular Europe rightly describes you moral parasites as "christian atheists" you behave like christians while casting off the select little bits you don't like (usually to do with sex) then make the idiotic assumption that your behavioural standard is self evident.
I know that the teachings of Jesus are good, that is why i am a Christian. I give credit where credit is due.
allabaster at 8:12AM on Aug 7th 2008
19. Nietzsche wasn't necessarily an atheist. True, he didn't exactly have a belief in God - - but he didn't completely dismiss the possibility of God or a creator outright.
"God is dead" simply means a world free of God's influence - - and Nietzsche predicted that the world had reached a point where God would no longer play an influential role in peoples lives - - thus giving people a lack of interest in maintaining any values whatsoever. That phrase isn't about God's literal death or lack of existence - - it's about the absence of a heavenly influence on Earth.
Tony Messinger at 8:28AM on Aug 7th 2008
20. I am the first to admit that Christianity has some beautiful concepts and Christian organizations have done good the world over.
But people that want us to give Christianity credit rarely want to look at the *net* effect. I'm just not convinced the *net* result is positive.
Ryan Anderson at 8:36AM on Aug 7th 2008
21. Even if Christianity deserves partial credit for the development of the ideals of liberty, equality, and fraternity (which, the last time I looked were promulgated during the French revolution by philosophers, not declared Christians), this in no way supports Dinesh's assertion that present day unbelievers "owe" anything to Christianity. In order for such people to "owe" something, there would need to be a history of Christianity (and, in poarticular, the Catholic Church) having supported these ideals to the benefit of all people, regardless of their church affiliation or lack thereof. History is replete with just the opposite; the Church, in particular, and Christianity (to a lesser estent) in general, has rarely suggested that these ideals should be applied universally. The Greek and Roman philosophers (obviously not Christian) whose thoghts on the nature of humanity and life certainly were at least the germinal center for these ideals may also have excluded some people (i.e. slaves) from these "univeral" ideals, at least did not limit them because of disbelief in "the gods" nor did they credit them to a deity; rather, they saw them as "self-evidently" good principles which could be applied universally with benefit to all and without negative effect upon human society.
Harvey at 8:49AM on Aug 7th 2008
22. Gosh, I wonder when the learned Kumar will come out and further discuss the ideas presented on this blog. Amazing how Kumar just seems to continue dd'd thoughts, as if....as if....
THE POWER OF CHRIST COMPELS YOU!!!
THE POWER OF CHRIST COMPELS YOU!!!
THE POWER OF CHRIST COMPELS YOU!!!
- Piyush Jindal
America's Most Gangsta at 9:10AM on Aug 7th 2008
23. As far as I know, Christianity did not invent the ideas of liberty and equality. Remember that when christianity came to Europe, it tried to forcefully take over all of the continent. People who dared to stand against the church were jailed, executed, or banished. When the Puritans left England because they were persecuted, they arrived in America, and began to persecute amongst themselves.
Granted much of the ideas of american law has christian values in it, but those values have their origins in greek and roman society. And those ideas had their beginnings elsewhere as well.and so on.and so on.......
CaptainCack at 9:27AM on Aug 7th 2008
24. Typical blog from double d. Name calling idolator. Will "christians" please read the bible? Do you people realy think santa jesus would look kindly on your damnation of anyone with a different thought process? I would bet double d masturbates to posters of himself while hosing himself down with gold spray paint on a nightly basis. Tolerance?Humility? "A [christian] knows not these things". So sit on your throne of judgment all the while preaching about a belief that you yourself and your hatefull little sheep know nothing about. Read the friggen bible!!!!!!
DarthAardvark at 9:41AM on Aug 7th 2008
25.
I would bet double d masturbates to posters of himself while hosing himself down with gold spray paint on a nightly basis. Tolerance?Humility?
****
That would make him Dinesh D'Buddha.
T.Brough at 10:52AM on Aug 7th 2008
26. Yet more pseudo-intellectual garbage from pompous, self-righteous seculars who would like to lump all Jews and Christians into one vast broth of hatred, bigotry, and followers of fantasy. These are the same people who blindly and conveniently ignore any of the noble contributions that people of faith have made to the arts and sciences, and to the well-being of humanity. Your comments show a close mindedness and contempt for ideas and values that do not mirror your human-centered world view.
These are the very traits you wish to foist on those of us who do believe in God. Why not take some of your own advice and try thinking for yourself?
fiorini45 at 11:20AM on Aug 14th 2008
27. That is an interesting observation allabaster... christian atheists... I like it.
Shannie at 11:34AM on Aug 7th 2008
28. From Dinesh's article:
"For the normative self-understanding of modernity, Christianity has functioned as more than just a precursor or catalyst. Universalistic egalitarianism, from which sprang the ideals of freedom and a collective life in solidarity, the autonomous conduct of life and emancipation, the individual morality of conscience, human rights and democracy, is the direct legacy of the Judaic ethic of justice and the Christian ethic of love."
Maybe this is true, maybe it isn't. Why, if democracy flows so naturally from Christianity, did it take so many centuries under Christianity to get it right? Why, if the ideal of freedom follows inevetibly from Christianity, did so many practicing Christians hold slaves?
If a Christian can see no contradiction between his religion and involving himslef in the slave trade then maybe, just maybe, an atheist can see no contradiction in rejecting Christianity and rejecting slavery.
insaneatheist at 11:47AM on Aug 7th 2008
29. Not speaking for anyone but myself here, but my take on the situation is that there is a large fund of good, common-sense wisdom to be found in the bible. However, I still reject the picture the bible paints of the Judeo-Christian "god". We've been all over that in the last few weeks, let's not start it up again, k?
In short, the bible isn't god or Christianity, it's stories about god and christianity.
GearHedEd at 11:58AM on Aug 7th 2008
30. That is an interesting observation allabaster... christian atheists... I like it. -Shannie
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I have always suspected that a lot of the christian majority in this country were of a similar belief....call 'em agnostic christians?
mac at 12:00PM on Aug 7th 2008