What is the source of that liberty, equality and fraternity that are now the guiding principles of the West, if not the modern world?
Historians note the anomaly that these principles originated and developed only in Western civilization. In this sense, they are not universal. Of late, however, these principles are being exported to the rest of the world. One may say they are Western in origin but universal in their application.
But where do the principles come from? With the death of Heidegger and Sartre, Jurgen Habermas is now regarded as perhaps our leading living philosopher. Habermas is also an atheist. Yet when Habermas found out that the European Union in its charter gave full acknowledgement to ancient Greece and Rome, but none to Christianity, he erupted in learned outrage.
Habermas's argument is that it is philosophically illiterate to locate the roots of the West in Athens but not in Jerusalem. In fact, Habermas argues that Jerusalem--by which he means Judaism and Christianity--is far more responsible than Athens for the modern principles of liberty, equality and fraternity. In "A Time of Transition," Habermas writes:
For the normative self-understanding of modernity, Christianity has functioned as more than just a precursor or catalyst. Universalistic egalitarianism, from which sprang the ideals of freedom and a collective life in solidarity, the autonomous conduct of life and emancipation, the individual morality of conscience, human rights and democracy, is the direct legacy of the Judaic ethic of justice and the Christian ethic of love.
Habermas's point is that there is too much arrogance in contemporary atheism. Even the atheist is standing on mountain erected by Christianity. How ungrateful it is to scorn the mountain that is still holding you up! How ridiculous the posture of the man who cannot acknowledge the very foundation that sustains him from below!
This is what Christians mean when they say that America is a Christian society. This is not a call for theocracy or "rule of the priests" but rather a call for a public acknowledgement of the historic role of Christianity in shaping our institutions, our values and our culture. The opinions of several leading Supreme Court justices on church-and-state issues would benefit greatly from a slight familiarity with the history that Habermas is talking about.
Habermas's argument would have struck a chord with the greatest atheist of modern times, the philosopher Nietzsche. Nietzsche argued that if you want to get rid of the Christian God, at least have the honesty and the guts to repudiate the Christian ideals of human dignity, human equality and human liberty.
Yet our village atheists want to have it both ways. They want to reject God but preserve at least certain core aspects of the Christian legacy. Nietzsche would have had nothing but scorn for these little men of unbelief, Lilliputians hurling their tiny javelins at the Christian God while they continue to live off His inheritance.
Reader Comments ( Page 4 of 29)
46. D'Souza says, "This is what Christians mean when they say that America is a Christian society."
I think that this is simply a bald-faced lie!
Did D'Souza do a poll asking Christians what they mean by, "America is a Christian society." ?
I'm sure that if asked, most Christians WOULD say, given the choice of 'yes' or 'no', that America IS a Christian society because it is based on liberty, equality and fraternity.
But, if just asked the question, "Why is America a Christian society?", most would say some piffle like, "Because the Constitution says, 'Freedom of religion not freedom FROM religion!' and be quite chuffed about that precious gem of wisdom that they had imparted to us.
This is presupposing, of course, that they had not been coached by their pastor that Sunday to parrot some other drivel, ahem, I mean 'pearl of wisdom'.
not-pboyfloyd at 1:52PM on Aug 7th 2008
47. What Dinesh is saying is that Judaism and Christianity is the foundation upon which many of our ideas regarding human equality and dignity derive. He is not saying that no other culture is ethical. According to Saint Paul, truth is written in our hearts; truth of man's dignity before God. Judaism and Christianity are unique because the relationship between God and Man is fully revealed. Man's image is restored. Prior to that revelation you might liken our vision to St. Paul’s quote, “For now we see through a glass, darkly.” The quest then became to share this revelation with the rest of humanity. Mistakes were made, but the foundation was in place. Compare that to Hinduism which has as a primary characteristic human inequality.
janesophie1 at 1:56PM on Aug 7th 2008
48. The Christian Cult is split into many different factions who totally disagree with one another. I know Christians who firmly believe the Pope is the Anti-Christ. Spare me your nonsence DD and fix your own mess before you start preaching preach to me....
Larry at 1:57PM on Aug 7th 2008
49. I think it is worth mentioning that it is nearly impossible to know whether the ideals of freedom and democracy would have arisen if Judaism/Christianity had never existed (assuming these religions were, in fact, causes of these ideals).
insaneatheist at 2:05PM on Aug 7th 2008
50. janesophie says, "What Dinesh is saying is that Judaism and Christianity is the foundation upon which many of our ideas regarding human equality and dignity derive."
Well, my dear janesophie, if you read your booklets, you'll notice that the Jews want liberty for themselves, egality for no-one, and fraternity for themselves, all the way through.
Today Israel is a theocracy. Are you going to try to tell us janesophie that Israel just wants liberty for all in the Middle East? How about egality, is that all they want? Fraternity? They just want to be 'brothers' with the Palestinians right?
Is Israel just a bad example today?
not-pboyfloyd at 2:11PM on Aug 7th 2008
51. Morality has nothing to do with being christian; has nothing to do with a belief in god or jesus.
Immoral behavior is not practiced by atheists exclusively. This atheist does not reject the notion of a god/jesus because I want an excuse to act immorally.
I don't need one for that - just ask my catholic family who have divorced, lived in sin, committed adultery, pedophilia, theft, drug use, and many other sins too numerous to name, yet still feel inclined to attend church to be forgiven for their sins. Do they think not to act this way? Hell no, that wouldn't be any fun. but they have no problem judging me for not lining up behind their bandwagon of hypocrisy.
How ever the West was won, one thing is certain - it is forever changing and hopefully for the better. This nation will never be a christian nation. This Nation will be one of religious freedoms - freedom to choose your lifestyle with or with out the express permission from religious zealots who feel the need to tell the rest of the human race how they should live their lives. I don't want a christian nation, I don't want a Muslim nation or an islamic nation or a jewish nation. I want a secular nation, where I don't have to choose.
And I won't be forced to live a life of hypocricy.
TJ at 2:11PM on Aug 7th 2008
52. What Dinesh is saying is that Judaism and Christianity is the foundation upon which many of our ideas regarding human equality and dignity derive. - janesophie
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Yeah, I get it jane, it just wouldn't be true. The foundation for all cultures and our budding nation is one of human equality and dignity - that much is true, but to say that it has been forged from Christianity and Judaism would negate all other cultures before that. Each one in itself has effected what was to come and will continue to effect our society until we are no more.
It is ridiculous to think that Christianity has/had that much impact on the culture that we see today in our nation - to think it was structured according to its dictates alone is puerile and childish.
Thankfully our forefathers understood that our shores would continue to be open to all cultures and they needed to impress upon all who came that tolerance toward that diversity was a must. It isn't a christian thing - it's a human thing, and christians need to stop taking all the credit - especially when it isn't due.
TJ at 2:25PM on Aug 7th 2008
53.
Or the ideas of freedom and dignity arose as an opposition to christian hegemony, which would be worthwhile to pursue in study.
JefFlyingV at 2:32PM on Aug 7th 2008
54. Nice posts, TJ - 50,51.
naturalpuppy at 2:35PM on Aug 7th 2008
55.
Tamala you've earned an extra slice of cheesecake today.
JefFlyingV at 2:44PM on Aug 7th 2008
56. D'Souza says, "This is what Christians mean when they say that America is a Christian society. This is not a call for theocracy or "rule of the priests"..."
I don't think that Theocracy is necessarilly a 'rule of priests'.
Rule by a 'Godly' President...
... who sees fit to rule by signing statement.
...who sees fit to go to war because 'God told him to.'
...who sees fit to remove basic freedoms. Right to privacy and habeas corpus for example.
...who takes advice from the 'priests' like Ted Haggard.
...who hires 'Godly' people to stack the civil service with more 'Godly' people.
Then there is the vice-President who thinks that he IS God. How theocratic is THAT?
not-pboyfloyd at 2:49PM on Aug 7th 2008
57. I liked D'Souza's last statement here, "Ignore the evidence, just think about what 'I' am saying here, ignore the evidence."
Oh yea, he didn't come right out and say that, did he?
not-pboyfloyd at 3:03PM on Aug 7th 2008
58. His entire blog was another appeal to authority. That being said, this is the first time in a long time I've agreed with most of what he wrote.
Sartre said something to the effect of, since there was not any god, and man being forlorn because of it, he must act as if there was a god.
Sartre knew full well that whether it's based in a fairy tale or not, morality or respect for human dignity cannot be based in atheism itself. There's no reason for it, and thusly no point to it.
The only thing I disagree with Dinesh on is the contribution of mathematics, which seems on the whole to be birthed from various parts of the world. The west would never have succeeded without it.
oneblood at 3:15PM on Aug 7th 2008
59. DD is saying that if you are going to accept good ideas, such as freedom and equality, then because they came from Xtian values (which they didnt) then you must logically accept god too.
Where does he get off making this connection? The ideas of freedom and equality were not invented by christians, nor are they the sole property. If I want to be free, I dont have to accept god to do so. This guy is something else.
I wonder how much the republican, right-wing evangelical mouthpiece pays him to spout this crap.
CaptainCack at 3:17PM on Aug 7th 2008
60. Hey Baby!! Cheesecake for everyone - it should be one of those natural freedoms we are all entitled to.
TJ at 3:19PM on Aug 7th 2008